House of Commons Journal Volume 9
29 June 1685

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1802

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'House of Commons Journal Volume 9: 29 June 1685', Journal of the House of Commons: volume 9: 1667-1687 (1802), pp. 751-753. URL: http://british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=27899 Date accessed: 27 November 2014.


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Lunæ, 29 die Junii, 1685. 1Jac. IIdi.

Prayers.

Bangor Cathedral.

AN ingrossed Bill, sent down from the Lords, intituled, An Act for Repair of the Cathedral Church of Bangor, and for the Maintenance of the Choir there, and for the Augmentation of the Revenue of the Bishoprick of Bangor; and for an Augmentation of several Vicarages within the Comportions of Llandinum in the Diocese of Bangor aforesaid; was read a Second time.

Resolved, That the Bill be committed to Mr. Ryves, Mr. Paston, Mr. Essex Strode, Dr. Perrott, Sir Orlando Gee, Sir Richard Lloyd, Sir Edward Herbert, Mr. Mellish, Mr. Waldron, Sir Tho. Clarges, Sir Tho. Exton, Mr. Wareing, Mr. Christy, Mr. Grenvill, Sir Geo. Winneve, Sir Dan. Fleming, Mr. Price, Sir Wm. Cooke, Mr. Walcott, Sir Phil. Egerton, Sir Fra. Clark, Mr. Dolben, Mr. Wogan, and all the Members for both Universities, and for North Wales and South Wales: And they are to meet at Three of the Clock this Afternoon, in the Speaker's Chamber.

Register of Deaths, &c.

A Bill for registring the Deaths, Burials, Marriages, and Issue, of the Nobility and Gentry of England, was read a Second time.

The Question being put, That the Bill be committed;

The House divide.

The Yeas go forth.

Tellers, Sir Richard Temple, for the Yeas, 75.
Mr. Bickerstaffe,
Tellers, Mr. Wogan, for the Noes, 83.
Mr. Price,

And so it passed in the Negative.

Resolved, That the Bill be rejected.

Ordered, That Leave be given to bring in a Bill, upon the Debate of the House, for registring the Deaths, Burials, Marriages and Issue, of the Nobility and Gentry of England: And that Mr. North, Mr. Christy, and Mr. Wogan, do prepare and bring in the same.

Army Accounts.

Mr. Done reports from the Committee appointed to inspect the Accounts of the Commissioners for disbanding the late Forces, That the Committee, having taken the same into their Consideration, had agreed upon a Report, which they directed him to present to the House in Writing: Which he read in his Place; and afterwards delivered the same in at the Table: Where the same being read, is as follows;

The Question being, Whether Sir Gilbert Gerrard, Sir Thomas Player, Colonel Birch, and Colonel Whitley, the Commissioners for disbanding the Army, ought jointly to be charged with, and accountable for, the 100,000£. received by Sir Thomas Player, at the Exchequer, for that Service;

Resolved, That the said Commissioners are jointly chargeable with, and accountable for, the said Money.

In relation to the Report to be made to this House;

The Question being, Whether the Committee should report to the House, What Sums did appear, upon Examination of the Commissioners Accompts, to be vouched, should be so reported; and, What did appear to be unvouched, should be reported unvouched;

Resolved, by the Committee, That it should be so re ported.

The Question being, Whether it be the Opinion of the Committee, That the House should be moved, That (seeing the Committee cannot make a perfect Examination of the Deputy Commissioners Accompts for disbanding in the Out Districts; likewise what has been paid for Cloaths and Quarters; as also to the Officers of the Army upon Debentures, and otherwise; and to ascertain, How far the Money given by the Act fell short of answering the End for which it was given), for the Satisfaction of all Persons concerned, Publication should be made, That they come in, and make out their Demands, in the Time of the Recess of the Parliament;

To all which, the Committee agreed.

A further Question being, Whether it should be reported to the House, That Mr. Kingdon has accounted for, and is legally discharged of, the Sum of 22,311£. 15s. 9d. received out of the Exchequer; being Part of the 206,462£. 17s. 3d. given by the Act for disbanding the Army;

Resolved in the Affirmative.

Resolved, That the Contents hereafter following be Part of the Report from the Committee to the House.

As to the Method of their Proceeding; the Care of the Committee in general was, to get before them such Accompts and Papers as were needful; and then to put those Accompts and Papers into the most expeditious and safe Way of Examination: For the First, the Committee gave Order to the said Commissioners, to produce, and deliver to them, all Accompts, Papers, and Vouchers they had, of what Nature soever, relating to this Affair: Which they did; and at the same time declared, They were all the material Vouchers they had to offer in Discharge of their respective Accompts: And likewise desired Sir Robert Howard to certify the Committee, What Money was received upon the last Disbanding Act; and How, and to Whom, the same was issued and paid; and likewise, what Debentures were drawn by the Commissioners; and for what Services; and what had been paid for Interest: All which Sir Robert has punctually done.

When the Committee were possessed of the said Accompts, Papers, and Vouchers, their next Care was, to put them into a proper Method of Examination; and therefore desired several Gentlemen of the Committee, whom they conceived fit and able to perform this Service, to peruse the said Accompts, and to compare them with their proper Vouchers: Who readily undertook it, and agreed to meet de die in diem, in the Court of Wards, for Performance thereof: Which they, or some of them, have since constantly done, and made what Progress, for the time, they could, in the said Examination.

And further reports, How the Committee did, upon Examination, find their Accompts, so far as they have been able to look into them; for that, for want of Time, they have not been able to make near so perfect an Examination as is needful. And, first, The Committee, upon Examination, finds, That by the Consent and Approbation of the other Commissioners, Sir Thomas Player did receive out of the Receipt of his Majesty's Exchequer, for disbanding the Army, the Sum of 100,000£.

Whereof he discharges himself in this following Method; viz. £. s. d.
By Money paid to Forces disbanded by Sir Gilbert Gerrard 8,663 15 1
By Money paid the Forces disbanded by Colonel Whitley 9,046 18 10½
By Money paid the Forces disbanded by Colonel Birch 25,105 3 4
By Money paid to Forces disbanded by their Deputies 38,291 18 6
By Money paid in Part for Cloaths 3,082 19 9
By Money paid for Exchequer Fees for the said 100,000 l. 360 15 8
By Money paid Geo. Blackborne for keeping Correspondence with Disbanders in the Out Districts 42 5 8
By Money paid to Tho. Corbyn for examining Accompts 62 12 -
By Money paid Wm. Jones for Disbanding in the Isle of Wight 20 - -
By Money paid the Four Commissioners, for their Allowance of 2d. per Pound 1,716 13 4
By Money paid to Forces disbanded by himself, which is made the Charge of Sir Thomas Player's particular Accompt of Disbanding 13,859 9 10
The Sums amount to 100,252 11 11½

Which is 252 l. 11s. 11d. ½ more than the Charge.

But we conceive, that 124£. 17s. 8d. being paid to their Agents, ought to be borne out of their 2d. per Pound allowed by the Act for themselves and Servants.

The Committee comes now to give you the State of the Accompts of the said Commissioners, of the Money they paid to the Forces they severally disbanded.

In Examination whereof they have only compared their Accompts with the Establishment and Muster Rolls, as to the Numbers of Men established and mustered; but, for want of Time, have not been able to examine their Computations of the Officers and Soldiers Pay, to see that they are rightly calculated; which is a Thing necessary to be done, that, if any Errors do appear, they may be rectified, and the Accomptants charged with what they have placed to Accompt more than the Establishment and Muster Rolls will warrant.

And, first, of Sir Thomas Player; whom the Committee charges with the aforesaid Sum of £. s. d.
13,859 9 10
Who alleges to have paid to the Forces by him disbanded 13,859 9 10
Whereof he has produced Vouchers for 10,612 12 7
And there remains unvouched 3,246 17 3
Sir Gilbert Gerrard is charged, as before, with 8,663 15 1
In Discharge whereof he alleges to have paid 8,663 15 1
Whereof he produces Vouchers for 7,074 5 6
And there remains unvouched 1,589 9 7
Colonel Whitley is charged with 9,046 18 10½
In Discharge whereof he alleges to have paid 9,046 18 10½
Whereof he produces Vouchers 7,088 14 8
And there remains unvouched 1,958 4 2
Colonel Birch is charged with 25,105 3 4
In Discharge whereof he alleges to have paid 25,105 3 4
Whereof he produces Vouchers for 21,951 11 2
And there remains unvouched 3,323 12 2
Sub Commissioners in the Out Districts are charged with 38,291 18 6
For which legal and proper Vouchers are not produced for upwards of 30,000 - -

Thus far the Committee has proceeded in this Affair: There remains yet to be examined, What has been paid for Cloaths and Quarters; and, What remains due upon those Accompts, and also to the Officers of the Army, upon Debentures, or otherwise; and likewise to ascertain, how far the Money given by the Act fell short of answering the End for which it was given. The Committee thinks this Work will require a considerable Time to perfect the Examination thereof; possibly much more than this Session will allow: And, if so, this humble Proposal to this honourable House is, That some Order may be taken for the Performance thereof, during the ensuing Recess: Which the Committee conceives may best be done by appointing a select Number to meet at a certain Place, to make the aforesaid Examination and Adjustment; and, in order thereto, to receive, examine, and adjust the Pretensions of all Creditors, and others, concerned in this Matter; and to report the same to the House at their next Meeting: And, that all Persons, who are concerned therein, may be acquainted therewith, the Committee humbly conceives it will be needful, that some public Notice be given by publishing the same in the Gazette, or otherwise, as may be thought most convenient.

All which the Committee most humbly submits to the great Wisdom of this honourable House to determine.

Resolved, That the Matter of the said Report be recommitted to the same Committee: And they are impowered to prepare and bring in a Bill, upon the Debate of the House, for the taking and better adjusting of the said Accompts.

Foreign Protestants Nat.

A Bill for a general Naturalization of all such French Protestants as are now residing in England, Wales, and Berwick upon Tweed, or the Isles of Jersey and Guernsey; and such others as shall come over within some limited time; was read.

Resolved, That the Bill be read a Second time.

Leave of Absence.

Ordered, That Sir John Cordell, a Member of this House, have Leave to go into the Country.

General Register.

A Bill for a general Registry of Estates, Titles, and Incumbrances, was read the Second time.

Resolved, That the Bill be committed to Sir Tho. Meres, Mr. North, Lord Falkland, Mr. Christy, Sir Jos. Williamson, Lord Digby, Mr. Solicitor General, Mr. Serjeant Maynard, Mr. Bulkley, Mr. Wogan, Mr. Bickerstaffe, Mr. Tipping; Mr. Butler, Sir Chr. Wren, Mr. Geers, Mr. Gunter, Sir Jos. Tradenham, Mr. Fanshaw, Sir Tho. Clarges, Mr. Smith, Sir John Brampston, Sir John Hoskins, Mr. Duncombe, Sir Dan. Fleming, Sir Tho. Darcy, Mr. Porter, Sir Richard Temple, Sir William Cooke, Sir John Wynn, Mr. John Hoskins, Mr. Mellish, Sir John Lowther, Sir Chr. Musgrave, Sir George Pudsey, Sir Hen. Goodrick, Sir Dudley North, Mr. Montague, Mr. Walker, Sir Hump. Winch, Sir Cha. Holt, Sir Tho. Hussey, Mr. Ashburnham, Sir Orlando Gee, Sir Fra. Clark, Mr. Paston, Mr. Hodges, Lord Ranelagh, Colonel Lee, Sir Benj. Bathurst, and all the Members of the Long Robe, or any of them: And all that come are to have Voices: And they are to meet at Three of the Clock this Afternoon, in the Speaker's Chamber. And the particular Care of the Bill is recommended to Mr. North.

Preservation of King's Person, &c.

An ingrossed Bill for the Preservation of His Majesty's Person and Government, was read the Third time.

And an Amendment being made thereto at the Table;

Resolved, That the Bill do pass: And that the Title be, An Act for the better Preservation of his Majesty's Person and Government.

Ordered, That Sir Edward Herbert do carry up the Bill to the Lords for their Concurrence.

Ludgarsell Election.

Ordered, That the Matter, touching the Election of Burgesses to serve for this present Parliament for the Borough of Ludgarsell in the County of Wilts, be put off: And that it be heard before the Committee of Elections and Privileges, the First Saturday of the next Meeting of this Parliament, after the ensuing Recess.

Committees.

Ordered, That all Committees be revived; and do sit at Three of the Clock this Afternoon, in the respective Places formerly appointed.

Barnstable Election.

Ordered, That the Merits of the Election for Barnstable in the County of Devon, be heard before the Committee of Elections and Privileges, at the next Meeting after the Recess.

And then the House adjourned to Nine of the Clock To-morrow Morning.