House of Lords Journal Volume 8
19 January 1646

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1767-1830

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'House of Lords Journal Volume 8: 19 January 1646', Journal of the House of Lords: volume 8: 1645-1647 (1767-1830), pp. 108-112. URL: http://british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=33936 Date accessed: 28 July 2014.


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DIE Lunæ, 19 die Januarii.

PRAYERS, by Dr. Wincupp.

Ds. Grey de Warke, Speaker.

Comes Essex.
Comes Kent.
Comes Pembrooke.
Comes Sarum.
Comes Bolingbrooke.
Comes Lyncolne.
Comes Midd.
Comes Denbigh.
Comes Warwicke.
L. Viscount Say & Seale.
Comes Nottingham.
Ds. North.
Ds. Robertes.
Ds. Howard.
Ds. Willoughby.
Ds. Wharton.
Ds. Bruce.
Ds. Dacres.
Ds. Mountague.
Ds. Berckley.

Letter from Sir T. Glemham, with One from the King.

The Speaker acquainted the House, "That he had received a Letter, brought him by a Trumpeter:

For the Right Honourable the Speaker of the House of Peers pro Tempore.

My Lord,

"I am commanded by His Majesty to send your Lordship His Letter here inclosed to both Houses of Parliament, which I am to pray your Lordship to deliver (fn. *) according to the Directions; and so I rest,

"My Lord,

Your Lordship's humble Servant,

Oxford, this 17th of January, 1645.

"Tho. Glemham.

King's Letter, desiring a positive Answer to His Request for a Personal Treaty at Westm.

CHARLES Rex,

"His Majesty thinks not fit now to answer those Aspersions which are returned as Arguments for His Not-admittance to Westm. for a Personal Treaty, because it would enforce a Stile not suitable to His End; it being the Peace of His miserable Kingdoms: Yet thus much He cannot but say to those who have sent Him this Answer, That if they had considered what they have done themselves (in occasioning the shedding of so much innocent Blood, by withdrawing themselves from their Duty to Him; in a Time when He had granted so much to His Subjects, and in violating the known Laws of the Kingdom, to draw an exorbitant Power to themselves over their Fellow Subjects (to say no more) to do as they have done); they could not have given such a false Character of His Majesty's Actions. Wherefore His Majesty must now remember them, that, having some Hours before His receiving of their last Paper of the 13th of January, sent another Message to them of the 15th, wherein, by divers Particulars, He enlarges Himself, to shew the Reality for His Endeavours for Peace, by His desired Personal Treaty (which He still conceives to be the likeliest Way to attain that blessed End); He thinks fit by this Message to call for an Answer to that, and indeed to all His former; for certainly no rational Man can think their last Paper can be any Answer to His former Demands; the Scope of it being, That, because there is a War, therefore there should be no Treaty for Peace, and is impossible to expect that the Propositions mentioned should be the Ground of a lasting Peace; when the Persons that send them will not endure to hear their own King speak: But whatever the Success hath been of His Majesty's former Messages, or how small soever His Hopes are of a better, considering the high Strain of those who deal with His Majesty; yet He will neither want Fatherly Bowels to His Subjects in general, nor will He forget that God hath appointed Him for their King with whom He treats: Wherefore He now demands a speedy Answer to His last and former Messages.

"Given at the Court at Oxford, this 17th of January, 1645.

For the Speaker of the House of Peers pro Tempore; to be communicated to the Two Houses of Parliament at Westm. and the Commissioners of the Parliament of Scotland.

"For the Speaker of the House of Peers pro Tempore."

Ordered, That this Letter be communicated to the House of Commons; and that the Members of this House that are of the Committee of both Kingdoms do communicate it to the Commissioners of the Kingdom of Scotland.

Message to the H. C. with it.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Edw. Leech and Mr. Page:

To deliver the King's Letter to the House of Commons.

Answer from thence.

The Answer returned by Doctor Aylett and Doctor Heath was:

They agree to the Alterations in the Ordinance for pressing of Soldiers, and concerning the Militia of London: (Here enter them.) To all the rest, they will send an Answer by Messengers of their own.

Ordinances, &c. for Concurrence.

Next, the Ordinance to pay to Serjeant Major Peter Baxter Two Hundred Pounds, was read, and Agreed to.

(Here enter it.)

The Order for paying Two Thousand Five Hundred Pounds to Colonel Points, was read, and Agreed to.

(Here enter it.)

The Ordinance for Interest to be paid for the Fifteen Hundred Pounds, charged upon the Excise, for the Welch Drovers, was read, and Agreed to. (Here enter it.)

The Order for paying One Hundred Pounds to Mr. Bedford, was read, and Agreed to. (Here enter it.)

The Ordinance for Five Hundred Pounds to be paid, out of the Excise, for Windsor, was read, and Agreed to.

(Here enter it.)

Ordinance for Mrs. Fiatt to have 100£. out of Sir P. Carteret's Estate.

The Ordinance for Mrs. Mary Fiatt to have One Hundred Pounds, out of Sir Philip Carterett's Estate, in the Isle of Sarke, was read, and committed to these Lords following:

Comes Essex.
Comes Warwicke.
L. Dacres.
L. North.
L. Wharton.
L. Robertes.

Any Three.

Ordered, That nothing be done in this Business, until the Committee have reported the same to this House.

Hill and Pennoyer's Ordinance.

The Ordinance concerning Mr. Hill and Pennoyer, was read, and committed to these Lords following.

Comes Kent.
Comes Essex.
Comes Pembrooke.
Comes Sarum.
Comes Lyncolne.
Comes Warwicke.
Comes Midd.
Ds. North.
Ds. Robertes.

Post Meridiem.

Answer from the H. C.

Sir Edward Leech and Mr. Page return with this Answer from the House of Commons:

That they have (fn. *) delivered the King's Letter to them.

Message from thence, for an Answer to be prepared to the King's Two last Letters;

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Sir Henry Mildmay Knight, &c.

1. To desire their Lordships Concurrence, that it may be referred to the Committee of both Kingdoms, to consider of the King's Two last Letters; and that an Answer to them may (fn. †) be drawn up, with the Advice of the Commissioners of the Parliament of Scotland for the Vindication of the Proceedings of both Parliaments.

Agreed to.

to expedite the Propositions;

2. To desire their Lordships would give Expedition in perfecting the Propositions to be sent to the King, for Peace; that so they may be entirely communicated to the Commissioners of Scotland.

and about Montrel's Pass to Oxford and Scotland.

3. They have received Information, that the French Agent for Scotland desires a Pass from the Houses to go to Oxford, and so into Scotland, and return to London; which they desire may not be given to him, nor any Foreign Minister, without a Pass be granted from both Houses; and that the Copy of the King's Pass to Montrell be communicated to the Scotts Commissioners.

No Foreign Minister to have a Pass to Oxford, but from both Houses.

Agreed to; and Ordered, That no Pass be granted to any Foreign Agent, to go into the King's Quarters, without the Consent of both Houses.

The Answer returned was:

Answer to the H. C.

That this House concurs in referring the drawing of an Answer to the King's Two last Letters, with the Advice of the Scotts Commissioners, for vindicating the Proceedings of the Parliaments of both Kingdoms: That this House agrees, that no Pass be granted to any Foreign Agent, into the King's Quarters, without the Consent of both Houses; and that the Copy of the King's Pass be communicated to the Scotts Commissioners: And touching the Expedition in the Propositions, this House will take them into Consideration.

Ordinance for Nisbett to be Minister of Kirklington.

The Ordinance for making Mr. Phillip Nisbett to be Minister of Kirklington, was reported, and read the Third Time, and Agreed to; and Ordered to be sent to the House of Commons, for their Concurrence.

Colonel Poyntz to make Enquiry about Mr. Park's Death, said to be murdered by Hardy.

"Ordered, That a Letter be written, from this House, to Colonel Poynts, that he cause a Council of War to examine the Death of John Parke, of Millthorpe, in the County of Westm.; he being killed, as this House is informed, by Roger Hardy, of Colonel Briggs's Regiment, upon the March of the Forces of the Parliament against the Lord Digby, when he passed those Parts towards Scotland."

Order for 200l. to Serjeant Major Baxter.

"Ordered, by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That the Committee of Lords and Commons for Advance of Monies at Habberdashers Hall (fn. *) do pay unto Serjeant Major Peter Baxter, Captain of Hurst Castle, upon Accompt, Two Hundred Pounds, to be deducted out of the Arrears due unto him upon his Entertainment."

Order for 2500l. for Colonel Poyntz's Forces.

"Whereas, by Ordinance of the 7th of October last, Five Thousand Pounds, with Interest, was charged in Course, on the Receipts of the Excise, by Ordinance of the 11th of September, 1643, for the Service of the Forces under the Command of General Sydenham Poynts; Two Thousand Five Hundred Pounds whereof the Commissioners of Excise have already advanced and lent: Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons assembled in Parliament, for the better Supply of the said Forces, That if any other well-affected Person or Persons shall advance and lend the Sum of Two Thousand Five Hundred Pounds, Residue of the Total charged as before mentioned, or any Part thereof, for the Use aforesaid; that every such Person or Persons, their respective Executors, Administrators, or Assigns, shall be satisfied and reimbursed the several and respective Sum or Sums so advanced, out of the Receipts of the Excise aforesaid, in Course of the Ordinance first above-mentioned, together with Interest for the same, at the End of every Six Months from the Time of the Advance thereof, or of any Part thereof, according as by the said next aforegoing Ordinance is directed; and the Receipt or Receipts of Henry Darley Esquire, a Member of the House of Commons, to whom the respective Monies advanced shall be paid, together with the particular Receipt or Receipts of the Persons that advanced the same, or of their Executors, Administrators, or Assigns, shall be the Commissioners of Excise their sufficient Warrant and Discharge for Payment of the said Two Thousand Five Hundred Pounds, and Interest, and every Part and Parcel thereof, accordingly."

Order for Interest to be allowed on 1500l. due to Davies & al. Welsh Drovers.

"Whereas, by Ordinance of the Lords and Commons, of the Thirtieth of December, 1645, One Thousand Five Hundred Pounds (Part of the Debts of Two Thousand Six Hundred and Fifty-three Pounds, due to Humphrey Davis, and the rest of the Welch Drovers) is granted to them, out of the Receipts of the Excise, in Course: It is now Ordered, by the said Lords and Commons, That Interest, after the Rate of Eight Pounds per Centum, shall be paid for the said One Thousand Five Hundred Pounds, for so long Time as the said One Thousand Five Hundred Pounds, or any Part thereof, shall be forborn, to such Person or Persons as shall advance the said Sum of One Thousand Five Hundred Pounds, or any Part thereof; and the Receipt or Receipts of John Glyn Esquire, Recorder of the City of London, or his Assigns, shall be a sufficient Discharge for the said One Thousand Five Hundred Pounds, and the Interest for the same, to the Commissioners of Excise for the Time being."

Order for 100l. to Mr. Bedford.

Whereas, by Ordinance of the 15th of October last, One Hundred Pounds were assigned to be paid in Course, out of the Receipts of the Excise, by Ordinance of the 11th of September, 1643, unto Mr. Bedford, Scout-master General; and whereas Thomas Foote Esquire, Alderman of the City of London, and the rest of the Commissioners of Excise and new Impost, have consented to a present Advance of the said One Hundred Pounds: Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons assembled in Parliament, That the said Commissioners of Excise and new Impost may satisfy and reimburse themselves, and that their Executors, Administrators, or Assigns, shall and may be satisfied and reimbursed, the said One Hundred Pounds, together with Interest for the same, after the Rate of Eight Pounds per Centum, for so long Time as the same, or any Part thereof, shall be forborn, out of such Intervals of Receipts, by the Ordinance of the 11th of September, 1643, as shall happen when other Assignments already made on those Receipts shall not fall due; and for Want of such Intervals, then as the same shall follow in Course; and that the said One Hundred Pounds shall be paid unto the said Mr. Bedford, whose Receipt, or of his Assigns, shall be a sufficient Discharge unto the Commissioners of Excise for the Time being, for Reimbursement and Payment of the said One Hundred Pounds, and Interest, and every Part and Parcel thereof."

Order for 500l. for Windsor.

"Be it Ordained, by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That Five Hundred Pounds shall be paid, for the Use of the Garrison of Windsor, out of such Intervals of Receipts on the Excise, to come in upon the Ordinance of the 11th of September, 1643, as shall happen when other Payments already assigned on those Receipts shall not fall due, or, in Default thereof, then as the same shall follow in Course; and the Commissioners of Excise or new Impost, are hereby authorized to pay the said Sum of Five Hundred Pounds, for the Use aforesaid, unto Christopher Whitchott, Governor of Windsor, or his Assigns, whose Receipt or Receipts shall be a sufficient Discharge to the Commissioners of Excise for Payment thereof accordingly."

Ordinance concerning the Militia of London.

"Whereas divers Persons, within the City of London, and Parts adjacent, within the Lines of Communication, and Parishes mentioned in the Weekly Bills of Mortality, and Hamlets of The Tower, that are not fit to bear Arms in their own Persons, yet are able and fit to find Arms, and pay others for bearing the same, but do neglect and refuse the doing thereof; and whereas divers Papists and ill-affected Persons do lurk and hide themselves in divers Houses and Places within the Limits aforesaid, that hold Correspondency with, or bring Intelligence from the Enemy, and others that gather together Arms, Ammunition, and other Materials of War, likely to be employed to the Prejudice of the Parliament (fn. *) and City; and whereas, by several Ordinances of Parliament, Power is given to the Committee for Ordering the Militia within the Limits aforesaid, and drawing out Forces for Service abroad, and that many Things mentioned in the said Ordinances to be put in Execution, require the Help and Assistance of more Persons, in the Nature of Sub-committees; (fn. †) thereupon Power is given to the said Committee, to make One or more Sub-committees, within the said Limits, as they shall think fit: And for the better enabling the said Subcommittees so made, or to be made, to perform the Service therein contained, the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, do Ordain and Declare, and be it Ordained and Declared, That the said Committee of the Militia of London shall have Power, and are hereby authorized, to impose upon all such Persons as have any Stocks going in Trade within the Limits aforesaid, and do either absent themselves, or do personally inhabit or reside within the said Limits, to find such Proportion of Arms, and pay such Persons, as have been, or shall be, appointed to bear the same, as the said Committee shall think fit, not exceeding Three Foot Soldiers for any One Person; and (fn. *) such Person or Persons as shall disobey the Commands and Directions of the said Committee of the Militia herein, the said Committee shall have Power to impose such reasonable Fines upon them, or any of them, as they shall think fit, not exceeding the Sum of Forty Shillings for any One Offence; and for Want of Payment thereof, to levy the same by Distress and Sale of their Goods and Chattels, or otherwise to imprison their Persons, without Bail or Mainprize, until such Time as they shall conform themselves accordingly; but in case such Person or Persons so offending do absent themselves without the said Limits, where the Authority of the said Committee doth not extend, and not a sufficient Value of his or their Goods or Chattels to be found within the said Limits whereon to levy the said Fines by Distress as aforesaid, that then the Committee of Lords and Commons of Sequestrations, upon Complaint made by the Committee of the Militia, or such as they shall appoint, being Persons of Ability and known Trust, do forthwith grant their Warrants for apprehending such Person or Persons wheresover they shall be, and to commit him or them to Prison, without Bail or Mainprize, until he or they do conform themselves, or to distrain his or their Goods, or bring them to London, and there sell them, to pay the said Fine or Fines; all which Fines are to be employed to such Use and Purpose, for the Safety and Defence of the said City of London, and Parts adjacent within the Lines of Communication, as the said Committee of the Militia shall think fit and direct.

"And it is further Ordained, That the said Committee for the Militia shall have Power, and is hereby authorized, by themselves or such as they shall appoint, being Persons of Ability and known Trust, to search all Houses and Places, within the Limits aforesaid, where the said Committee shall have Cause to suspect that any Papists are, or other Persons that come from any the King's Quarters, that cannot give a good Account of their Business or Abode within the Limits aforesaid, or that have or shall discover their Ill-affection to the Parliament, by any Offence for which they ought to be sequestered, questioned, or punished, by an Ordinance of Parliament; and likewise to search for Arms, Ammunition, and Materials for War, in the Custody of such Persons, and to seize and take away the same; and to commit such Persons to safe Custody, or to expel them out of the Liberties aforesaid, if they shall see Cause; and in Case of Resistance, the said Committee are hereby authorized to command any Constable or Constables to break open any House or Place within the said Limits, where such Resistance shall be made, in the Presence of any Two of the said Committee of the Militia, or of Two such as by the said Committee of the Militia shall be appointed, being Persons of Ability and known Trust.

"And be it further Ordained, That the said Subcommittees, so appointed, or to be appointed, by the said Committee of the Militia, shall have Power, and are hereby authorized, to cause all or any of the Clauses contained in this Ordinance to be put in due Execution, when and as often as they shall receive Directions from the said Committee for the Militia; and all Constables, Headboroughs, and other Officers and Soldiers, are hereby required to obey and execute such Warrants as they from Time to Time shall receive from the said Committee for the Militia, or other Sub-committees, for and concerning the Execution of the same accordingly.

"And it is further Ordered and Ordained, by the said Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled, That the said Committee for the Militia of London shall have Power to charge such Inhabitants who are constantly dwelling within the Lines of Communication and Bills of Mortality, or such Persons as have any Stocks going in Trade within the Limits aforesaid, and absent themselves, as they shall esteem able, to find and maintain Horses, with Riders and Furniture, at their proper Charge, for the Defence of the City and Parts adjacent, so as no Person shall be charged for the raising and maintaining of more than Two Horses, to be put under such Officers as the said Committee shall think fit.

"And it is further Ordained, That if any Person or Persons shall be charged to find Horse, Rider, and Furniture, as aforesaid, and shall refuse or neglect to provide the same within Eight Days after Notice thereof given to them in Person, or left in Writing at their Dwellings, shall forfeit and pay Twenty Pounds; and if they shall neglect or refuse to send for their said Horse or Horses, with Riders provided and furnished as aforesaid, when and as often as he or they shall be summoned thereunto by the said Committee of the Militia, or such Commanders or Officers as they shall appoint, in Default thereof, shall forfeit and pay Ten Shillings upon every such Failing, or suffer Four Days Imprisonment, without Bail or Mainprize; to be inflicted upon every such Offender in such Manner and Form, and by such Officers and Persons, as are appointed for the inflicting of the Penalties upon the Failing (of the Foot Soldiers of the Trained Band) expressed in an Ordinance dated the 2d of May, 1643; and the said Fines to be employed by the said Committee of the Militia towards the Payment of the Commanders and Officers of the said Horse, and for such other Uses as the said Committee shall find necessary for the better carrying on of the said Service.

"Provided, That no Power hereby granted, nor any Clause or Thing herein contained, shall be extended against any Peer of this Kingdom, or Member of either of the Houses of Parliament, or any of the Assistants of the House of Peers, or Attendants of the House of Peers or Commons; and as well the said Committee, as also their said Sub-committees and all other Persons acting in the Premises according to the Intent of this Ordinance, shall be saved harmless, by Authority of both Houses of Parliament. This Ordinance to continue for Nine Months, and no longer."

Adjourn.

House adjourned till 5a post meridiem (fn. *) .

Footnotes

* Deest in Originali.
* Origin. deliver.
Deest in Originali.
* Origin. to.
* Deest in Originali.
Origin. these upon.
* Deest in Originali.
* Sic.