House of Lords Journal Volume 4
2 November 1641

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1767-1830

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'House of Lords Journal Volume 4: 2 November 1641', Journal of the House of Lords: volume 4: 1629-42 (1767-1830), pp. 418-419. URL: http://british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=35704 Date accessed: 27 November 2014.


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DIE Martis, 2 die Novembris.

PRAYERS.

Harris, Sheriff of Carnarvon, about Shipmoney.

Upon reading the Petition of John Harris, late Sheriff of the County of (fn. *) Carnarvan, "desiring the Directions of this House for the re-paying of some Monies remaining in his Hands, which he collected for Ship-money when he was Sheriff:" Hereupon it is Ordered, That he re-pay the said Money according to the General Order of this House.

Thrust versus More, etc.

Upon reading the Petition of James Thrust, late Captain of a Troop of Horse in His Majesty's Army, complaining "That Armond Moore and Richd. Mackmiller, Soldiers, had spoken contemptuous Words of the Lord General and Sir John Conyers, etc. And the said James Thrust averred upon Oath the Petition to be true." It is Ordered, That the said Moore and Mackmiller shall be sent for, as Delinquents, to appear before this House, to answer the Charge of the Petition in Person.

E. of Bridgewater, etc. to put in their Answer to their Impeachment concerning Sir John Corbett.

Ordered, That the Earl of Bridgewater may send in his Answer to the Impeachment brought up against him and others, in the Cause concerning Sir John Corbet, upon the 9th of November Instant.

Bp. of Durham excused.

The Lord Bishop of Durham is excused for his Absence.

50,000 l. to be borrowed of London.

It being signified to this House, "That the Mayor and Aldermen of London were ready at Guildhall, expecting the Committees of both Houses to come thither, about the borrowing of Fifty Thousand Pounds for the Occasions of Ireland," their Lordships Resolved, To let the House of Commons know so much.

Then a Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Edw. Lecch and Dr. Bennett:

Message to the H. C. about it.

To acquaint them, that the Lord Mayor and Aldermen of the City of London are expecting the Committees of both Houses in London, about the Fifty Thousand Pounds; and to signify to them, that the Lords Committees are ready to go with them.

Phillips, a Priest, committed to the Tower, for Contempt of the House, in abusing the Bible.

This Day Robert Phillips, a Priest, at the Desire of the House of Commons, was brought to be sworn at the Bar, being to be examined by the Lords Committees, touching Matters concerning the State; and, hearing the Oath repeated to him, desired the Directions of the House, how far it was required of him to answer, alledging that the Oath was too general, and thereby he might be inforced to confess against himself: But the House resolved him this Doubt, that he was but to answer as a Witness, to reveal what he knew touching some intended Treason. Upon this, he offered to take the Oath; but presently said, "That he was not to be bound by the said Oath, because the Bible upon which he was sworn was not a true Bible;" which Words he repeated a Second Time, and then took the Oath. Hereupon the Lords commanded him to withdraw; and the House, taking this as an Affront and Scorn done to this House, and a great Scandal to our Religion, and considering that the Words which Le spake were voluntary, upon no Occasion given him, the House Resolved, He should for this be brought to the Bar as a Delinquent, to hear what Answer he would make to this Charge; who being brought to the Bar, as a Delinquent, upon his Knees, the Lord Keeper told him, "That the House hath a great Apprehension of the Affront shewed to this House of Peers, and of the great Scorn and Scandal shewed to our Religion, in saying the Bible which is allowed by the Law is not a true Bible:" Upon this he made a Profession, "That he was a Catholick; and that all Catholicks held this Opinion, that our Bible is not a true Bible; and, if he should have taken an Oath without this Declaration, he should have confirmed this to be a true Bible." This being such an insolent Carriage in the Face of a Parliament; the said Robert Phillips was commanded to withdraw, and the House, taking it into their serious Considerations, thought it fit that he should have a Mark of the Displeasure of this House, for his Derogation of our Religion, and for the great Dishonour done to the Peers: Hereupon it is Ordered, That the said Robert Phillips be committed to The Tower of London, there to remain until the further Pleasure of this House be known.

The Queen to be informed thereof.

And, because the aforesaid Robert Phillips is a Servant to the Queen, this House thought fit that She should be acquainted with the Reasons why he was committed: To this End, the Lord Seymour was appointed to attend the Queen. His Lordship obeyed the Command of the House herein, but desired to have what he should say from this House in Writing.

The Messengers return this Answer from the House of Commons:

Answer from the H. C.

That the select Committee of their House will be ready, when their Lordships shall please to appoint, to go to the City, about borrowing the Fifty Thousand Pounds.

Connelly sworn about the Treason in Ireland.

Owen Connellies, an Irishman, was sworn, and is to be examined by the Lords Committees, touching the Rebellion and Treason in Ireland.

Commanders in Ireland, sent over to their Charges.

Ordered, That the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland doth take Care that such Persons that are now in this Kingdom, and have Places of Command and Trust in Ireland, do speedily repair thither, to their several Charges, for the Defence of that Kingdom.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Sir William Massam, Baronet:

Message from the H. C. about the Committee for Ireland.

To let their Lordships know, that whereas their Lordships have appointed a select Committee of Twentysix, to consider of the Affairs of Ireland, the House of Commons have chosen a select Committee, of a proportionable Number of their House, for the same Business; therefore they desire to know what Time their Lordships will please to appoint, for to consider of those Businesses.

Ordered, That the Committee of this House shall meet with the select Committee of the House of Commons, to consider of the Irish Affairs, To-morrow Morning, at Nine a Clock, in the Painted Chamber.

Answer.

The Messengers were called in, and told that the Lords Committees for the Irish Business, will (fn. *) give the Committee of the House of Commons a Meeting, Tomorrow Morning, at Nine a Clock.

Committee to draw up a Declaration of the State of England and Ireland.

Ordered, That these Lords following do meet with a select Committee of the House of Commons, to consider of, and draw up a Declaration, setting forth the State of England and Ireland, and the Dangers which that Kingdom is now in, by reason of the Rebellion there; and that the same be presented to the King, with some Reasons why the Parliament desires His Majesty's Presence here in England.

The Names of the Lords Committees: videlicet,

The L. Chamberlain.
Comes Bathon.
Comes South'ton.
Comes Bristoll.
L. Viscount Say & Seale.
Epus. Winton.
Epus. Lincolne.
Epus. Exon.
Epus. Rochester.
Ds. Mowbray.
Ds. Wharton.
Ds. Rich.
Ds. Kymbolton.
Ds. Howard de Charleton.
Ds. Roberts.
Ds. Pierpointe.

Their Lordships, or any Seven, to meet To morrow Morning, in the Painted Chamber.

Report of the Message delivered to the Marquis of Hertford about the Prince. His Answer.

The Lord Chamberlain reported, "That he had delivered the Order to the Lord Marquis of Hertford, concerning the Prince; and he returns this Answer, That he is ready to perform the Order of both Houses; and he says, the Reason why he waited not on the Prince at Oatlands was because there was no Room for him to lie there."

Report of the Message delivered to the Queen about him.

Likewise the Earl of Holland gave an Account to this House of his Message to the Queen, which was to this Effect: "That he had acquainted Her Majesty with the Reasons why the Houses desired the Prince might reside at his own House, under the Charge of the Lord Marquis of Hertford: One was, because he loses his Time of Learning, in being absent from his Tutor; and being at Oatlands, it was apprehended some illaffected in Religion there, might have some Design upon him: Likewise, there being lately Discovery of divers Treasons against the Kingdom, and the public Peace thereof, therefore both Houses desire, That the Security of the Prince might be provided for: To that End, both Houses have Ordered, That he reside at his own House, where he may have the Lord Marquis of Hertford to be continually with him, and his Servants constantly about him, to take Care of his Security and Education.

Her Majesty's Answer.

"And Her Majesty returns to both Houses of Parliament Thanks, for their Care of the Religion and Safety of Her Son; and She is very well pleased with the Order made by both Houses, for the Prince residing at his own House; and, before his Lordship came to the Queen with the Message, Her Majesty had given Order to the Lord Marquis of Hertford, for the Prince's Removal from Oatelands to Richmond."

The Lord Chamberlain and the Earl of Holland are to give the same Account to the House of Commons, at a Conference, as they did this Day to this House.

Conference about Guards for the Parliament.

Ordered, To have a Conference with the House of Commons, to propose unto them that some Course may be taken for to provide some Guards to attend the Houses of Parliament.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Robert Rich and Sir Edward Leech:

Message to the H. C. for it, and about the Messages to the Queen and the Marquis of Hertford, relative to the Prince.

To desire a Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, so soon as it may stand with their Conveniency, in the Painted Chamber:

"1. Concerning the Directions given to the Lord Chamberlain, to acquaint the Marquis of Hertford with the Order concerning the Prince, and concerning the Directions given to the Earl of Holland, touching the acquainting the Queen with the Order made concerning the Prince.

"2. Concerning some Course to be taken for the providing of a Guard to attend the Houses of Parliament."

The Messengers return with this Answer from the House of Commons:

Answer.

That they will give a present Meeting, in the Painted Chamber, as is desired.

Then this House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, the House was resumed.

Adjourn.

Dominus Custos Magni Sigilli declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque in diem Mercurii, videlicet, 3m diem instantis Novembris, hora prima post meridiem, Dominis sic decernentibus.

Footnotes

* Origin. Narnarvan.
* Deest in Origin.