Friday, May 1, 1657.
Major-General Whalley presented a petition on the behalf
of Colonel John Fothergill, touching his arrears, that they
might be stated at Worcester House.
Colonel White moved that they might also be bonded as
well as stated, otherwise he would fall short of his desires.
All which was candidly received, and accordingly, nemine
contradicente, it was
Ordered by the Parliament, that it be referred to the Committee for stating accounts at Worcester House, and that
they be authorized and required to state the accounts of Colonel John Fothergill, for his arrears, and to give him debentures for the same, according to the rules prescribed to the
officers of the army; and that the trustees for the sale of the
lands of the late King, Queen and Prince, be authorized and
required to give him bond thereupon. (fn. 1)
Colonel Jones moved for a second reading of Mr. Lloyd's
Bill, which was done accordingly, without any motion or
He moved that it might be committed, by reason that the
matter of fact might be examined, to see whether it be so as
is set forth in the Bill.
Major-General Whalley. I am not against the commitment; but would be informed how it is that, instead of 1,500
acres, which he was disappointed of, upon his lot, as adventurer, he should have set out 3,500 acres.
Major-General Disbrowe. At the commitment the whole
may be examined.
A Bill for settling of Charles Lloyd of London, esquire,
in his lands in Ireland, in lieu of other lands fallen to him by
lot, as an adventurer, was committed to Sir Richard Onslow,
Mr. Burton, (and 26 more) to meet to-morrow, at two of the
clock in the afternoon, in the Duchy Court. (fn. 2)
Lord Broghill reported,—according to yesterday's order
from the Committee to whom the matter touching lands
given to several persons in Ireland was referred,—the opinion
of the Committee, viz.
That the orders of Parliament, or either House of the
Parliament, begun at Westminster, the 3rd of November, 1640, for the granting, or setting forth lands upon oath,
to Sir Charles Coote, Lieutenant-general Michael Jones, Sir
John Reynolds, Colonel Jerome Sankey, Sir George Aiscue,
Dr. Henry Jones, the relict of Sir Simon Harcourt, and the
relict of Colonel Benjamin Blundell, shall be, and are hereby
declared, to stand in force to all intents and purposes. (fn. 3)
On several orders of the Long Parliament, touching some
soldiers in former wars.
Mr. Bond moved that some person would give a particular
account of those orders, otherwise he knew not how to vote.
Lord Whitlock. By the allowance of those orders you
neither strengthen nor enlarge them. That gentleman, if he
had been at the Committee, might have seen the ground upon
which those orders were confirmed. I have heard some doubt
whether the dissolving of a Parliament doth not dissolve their
orders, and, therefore, it was thought fit to confirm them, as
in this Report.
Lord Broghill. They are the gifts of the Long Parliament
to your faithful servants, and those orders are all that they or
their widows have to show for them. It takes nothing from
you; it only makes them a better title, and it is but just and
reasonable you should confirm them.
Mr. Godfrey. It is fit that you should read and hear the
orders, that you may know what you confirm.
Colonel Carter. It is all the justice in the world that you
should confirm them to those that did you service for it, and
accepted it as good security.
Sir Charles Wolseley. It is not only an act of favour, but
of justice too, for you to confirm them.
Major-General Disbrowe. It were just for us to confirm
those orders, if we knew what they were: but not that, under
colour of them, the parties should get into possession of twice
as much as was fairly and clearly given.
Lord Broghill. It is intended that all these persons claiming by these orders, shall bring in several Bills to confirm
them, and then it will be time enough for that caution. (fn. 4)
Colonel Jones. I move that an order made in 49, for settling 100l. per annum, upon Dr. Owen, may be confirmed;
which was for his good service at Colchester. (fn. 5) It has been
paid hitherto out of the Exchequer, and it is now desired
that lands in Ireland, to the same value, may be settled in
lieu of it.
Mr. Bond seconded that motion, that it may be charged
upon Ireland; and he hoped that Ireland would in time
afford us many a 100l. a-year.
Mr. Godfrey. I have as much respect and obligation for
and to Dr. Owen as any man; yet I would have the order
examined, before you confirm it.
Lord Strickland. Though it be instanced in that service
of Dr. Owen at Colchester; yet all here know that he hath
done several good services for you elsewhere; and it is little
enough that you should confirm this to him which his Highness had taken such care to satisfy. (fn. 6)
Colonel Sydenham seconded it, and it was
Ordered, that a Bill be brought in, to settle lands of inheritance, of the clear yearly value of 100l. per annum, in Ireland, on John Owen, Doctor in Divinity, and his heirs, in lieu
of lands of 100l. per annum, formerly granted to him in England by the Parliament. And Colonel Jones is desired to
bring in a Bill accordingly. (fn. 7)
Sir Christopher Pack. Some of the Turkey Company are
waiting at the door, touching the business between Sir Sackville Crow and them. He did prosecute them at law, albeit
the sum was referred to a Committee, and the Committee
have been discontinued. I move that proceedings may be
stopped till the report come in.
Sir Charles Wolseley. It is against the liberty of the
subject to hinder any man of the benefit of the law, unless
you had sufficient grounds before you to stop them upon; and
therefore I move that till the Committee bring in the report
you will not grant any such injunction.
Colonel White. You had the like case before you yesterday, (fn. 8) and would not do any thing in it. I desire you will not
Alderman Foot. It is but just that proceedings be stopped, so that the hands may be bound on one part as well as
Mr. Fowell moved, that the Committee might be required
to hasten their report, and that, in the interim, proceedings
at law might be stopped.
Mr. Bond. I wonder why any man should be so impudent
as to proceed at law, while the business is depending before
a Committee. I therefore move, that not only proceedings
may be stopped, but that he (fn. 9) may be severely punished for
his contempt. He has been your great enemy, and what the
Turkey Company did was in order to your service. I would
have him sent to the Tower, as he was formerly, and fined.
Major-General Disbrowe. It is but just and reasonable
that proceedings should be stopped, till you understand the
business; which is certainly foul enough of his side, as I
have heard. He durst as well have taken a bear by the tooth
as offered such a thing in the Long Parliament, and you ought
to vindicate them.
Lord Striekland. I move to appoint a time for the report to be made, and to stop proceedings in the meantime.
Though he have been your enemy all along, yet I hope
there will once be a time, when men shall know whether
they have done good or ill.
Major Beake. There was never such an extravagant person
called before you as this man. He has made above sixty
defendants in this suit, to take away their testimony. The
proceedings appear to be black and dark enough on his part;
and unless you stop proceedings the parties are undone.
The trial will be on Tuesday next.
Sir Richard Onslow. At the first presenting of this business here you refused an injunction, because you knew not
whether it was the same business that the petitioners petitioned against; and you know no more now than you did then.
I therefore move that the report may be made to-morrow, or
on Monday; that you may have the matter before you to
judge, and take your rise thence for an injunction, if fit; but
that till then, you would not stop proceedings.
Sir William Strickland moved to appoint the report to be
brought in this day fortnight, and, in the mean time, to stop
Sir Thomas Wroth. The case yesterday (fn. 10) and this is different. The other was between your friends and friends, but
this is between your friends and your enemy. I therefore
move that proceedings may be stopped for a month, and that,
in the interim, the report may be ready and brought in.
Mr. Moody seconded that motion, and said he attended the
Committee, and the business was very foul, and therefore he
would have proceedings stopped for a month.
Colonel Jones. If the business already appear to be so
foul, the report will be the sooner ready. Therefore, there is
no need of a month's time. I shall move that it be within
Colonel Gorges. To inform as to matter of fact, it cannot
yet appear to the Committee that it is so foul. I had the
command to serve them in the chair. They have yet
examined but one party, and not any thing as to Sir Sackville
Crow's part. I move for longer time than a fortnight to
bring in the report.
Mayor Beake stood up and affirmed that there had been
examinations on both sides; but it seems they were but some
letters, or the like, to which Colonel Gorges agreed.
Mr. Trevor. For you to stop proceedings before you have
a report from your Committee, is a judging the case beforehand. I therefore move that you would grant no such injunction.
Mr. Hoskins. The case yesterday, as I apprehend, may
directly parallel with this. There you would grant no injunction, and the same remains, &c.
Ordered, that the Committee to whom the business of the
Turkey Company and Sir Sackville Crow was referred, do
make their report by this day fortnight, and that all proceedings at law, by the said Sir Sackville Crow against the said
Turkey Company, or any particular member thereof, touching the said business, be stayed in the mean time. (fn. 11)
Colonel Jones reported from the Committee appointed to
attend his Highness yesterday in the afternoon, that his Highness had appointed this day at ten for the Committee to wait
upon him. That time was past.
Resolved, that the Committee do attend his Highness accordingly.
Ordered, that the Resolution made upon the Report made
by the Lord Broghill, be part of the business to be presented
to his Highness, by the Committee appointed to attend his
Highness. (fn. 12) See the Report supra. (fn. 13)
Sir Charles Wolseley moved that the bill for recovery of
just debts might be read, but Sir Christopher Pack's motion
thrust his motion out, as before.
Colonel Jones moved to adjourn: some moved to adjourn
till Monday, others till Tuesday, and the House was divided
upon the question for Monday.
The question being put, that the House be adjourned till
Monday morning next,
The House was divided.
The Yeas went forth.
Yeas 37. Major-General Whalley and Colonel Purefoy,
Noes 49. Colonel Fothergill and Mr. Thistlethwaite,
So it passed in the negatiye.
Whitehall at 11.
The Committee attended his Highness in the Council
Lord Whitlock acquainted him that the House had considered of his scruples and doubts upon the Petition and Advice,
and had made several resolves in answer thereunto, which they
had commanded the Committee to acquaint his Highness
Lord Whitlock read the Report until he came to enumerate
the ordinances that were confirmed, &c. so he left off reading
and delivered the papers to his Highness.
He then acquainted his Highness with the further commands upon this Committee, (which his Highness, I perceive,
looked should have been mentioned at first, for he took the
order and read the latter end of it), that they would know of
his Highness when the House should wait upon him for his
positive resolution and answer to the Petition and Advice presented to him.
His Highness made this short return: that the papers
would ask some consideration, therefore he could not then
appoint the time, but he would acquaint the House when he
had considered of the time, and that in as short a time as
might be, or as he could. He spoke low. The Committee
did not stay above half an hour, in all.