Saturday, April 2, 1659. (fn. 1)
Mr. Grove reported from the Committee to whom it was
referred to prepare a Declaration of the grounds and reasons
for setting apart a day of fasting and public humiliation, the
draught of a Declaration setting forth the grounds and reasons
thereof. (fn. 2)
Colonel Terril. I move against the word "Parliaments"
standing in the Declaration. I would have it go alone to the
Protector: it being against your vote to do otherwise.
After a little debate the question was put.
Mr. Speaker declared for the Yeas.
Mr. Neville declared for the Noes.
The House was divided. The Yeas went out.
Noes 78. Mr. Grove and Mr. Moore, Tellers.
Yeas 104. Mr. Bishop and — (fn. 3) , Tellers.
Mr. Reynell, Mr. Young, and Mr. Poole went out with us.
Mr. Starkey and Major Beake had spoken learnedly to defend the word "Parliament," in the Declaration, and that we
were bound by our vote to transact.
Major Beake. If they dissent from this, they are not to be
Sir Henry Vane. I doubt this fast will not answer your
ends; therefore I am against the fast, upon, the grounds propounded. It will be but an hypocritical fast. We have been
but beating the bush all this while; but making essays as to
recognizing the Chief Magistrate. This imposition upon
consciences is, I fear, the setting up of that which you always.
cried out against, and disowned for your cause. I would
know what the settlement is.
Rather desire the Protector to put out a Declaration for a
fast, and leave it. This is giving away your cause. All is
lost. It is a coercing the conscience.
Mr. Onslow. This is but to amuse us, where no fear is.
We know whose work it is. There is not a word of coercion
in the Declaration. (fn. 4) I wish we could have seen some instance.
I hope those that speak against the thing, will be more unanimous in keeping the day. The objection being so general,
I can only give a general answer, that there is no such thing.
If I had heard of particulars, I should have answered them.
I know no reproach that it deserves.
Colonel Briscoe. I am at present against this programme;
but not for the reasons offered. The business is good; and
the better, the more expedition it ought to have; but you
have not agreed about the manner of transacting. It will ask
you a great deal of time.
Lord Marquis Argyle. It is a maxim in the Church of
Scotland, that ministers shall not meddle in civil affairs. The
Constitution of Scotland is against requiring the minister to
read the Declaration. If he cause it to be read, as Mr. Swin.
fen moved, it is all one.
Mr. Broughton. Qui per alium, per se, fecit. You will have
some men that haply will not be so active in reading this,
as too many things that we have passed. Finis operis, finis
operantis. I leave it to you to judge by what impulse they
brought it in. (fn. 5) Peace ought mainly to be aimed at. Impose it not, but leave it to their discretions. Twenty times
I beseech you, be tender, and do not impose upon gracious
spirits. I know what it is to have peace with God.
Sir Walter Earle. There is no penalty, therefore no
danger of requiring.
Colonel Okey. The most part of the godly people are
Major-general Kelsey. If it pass as it does, it will dissatisfy the ministers of Scotland; They allow no fast that
passes originally from the Chief Magistrate. They own no
thing of imposition from the Magistrate. Never was a fast
kept in Scotland since the Union. If it go, as thus worded,
I question how agreeable it will be to the three nations.
Mr. Godfrey. To make a minister a publisher of laws, is
to make him a civil officer. The minister's commission is to
"go teach all nations." (fn. 6) To clap any more upon him, is to
lay a weight upon him, and expose him to snares.
Let the Sheriff proclaim it. I move to recommit it for.
Mr. Young. His late Highness, that was as tender of consciences as any man, in all his Declarations, required the ministers to publish the Declaration, but did recommend it to
Sir Arthur Haslerigge. It was also required by the Chief
Magistrate, formerly, to read letters patent by the minister.
Mr. Bodurda. I move that the churchwarden publish it.
Mr. Boscawen was against that choice.
Mr. Charlton. This is not barely a civil thing, but a religious concern; and the minister is the proper officer to publish this.
Sir Henry Vane. Be careful how you oblige the Church
of Scotland. I plead for liberty of conscience for Scotland,
as well as for England. The Covenant was to care for the
liberty of both alike.
Colonel Birch. That gentleman has most reason to know
the grounds of the Covenant. (fn. 7) I am content to satisfy all
parlies. Instead of "require," I would have "recommend."
Mr. Annesley. The word "require," is all the word of
authority that is in the Declaration. Therefore I would have
Lord Marquis Argyle. I should be glad that this question might be a healing question among us. The end of the
Covenant is that we may be one, according to the word of
God, and the best reformed churches.
I believe the reading the Declaration will not be much
scrupled, so long as the matter pleases. If it be left free, it
will prove a loose business. Put in constables, churchwardens,
and other officers.
Mr. Charlton. I am against the word "recommend." It
is to leave it too much at loose. I would have "will and
Colonel Okey. I know divers ministers that will be out
town, if the word "require" stands.
Mr. Neville. I would not have the Church of Scotland
imposed upon, and I desire the like favour for England. Some
private congregations would be torn in pieces with wild
horses, rather than read this Declaration.
Sir James Mac Dowel. If the word "require" be suitable
for England, it will be so for Scotland. If they scruple not
the thing, there will be no falling out about the word. I would,
to satisfy all, have the word "recommend." I wish all the
ministers of the three nations were of one mind.
Mr. Gewen. If there be some that will not own your authority, is that any reason why you should not own your own
authority ? To clear it the better, let the chief officers be put
in to publish it.
Judge Advocate Whalley. The ministers, in 43, challenged
the appointment of fasts to themselves. I doubt it will not
pass in Scotland. There are no charchwardens in Scotland.
Colonel Allured. You have passed that which is more
strict; therefore it is indifferent whether the word "require,"
stand or no.
Major Beake. You have a magisterial coercion. Words
safer are not suitable to you. These words have been in
former Declarations for Scotland, and no complaint has been
made. The words have not been impeached. I would have
the word "require" stand.
Mr. Reynell moved that the word "require" might stand,
and it was resolved accordingly.
Mr. Grove moved an addition, viz. "and also to implore a
blessing from God upon the proceedings of this present Parliament."
Sir Henry Vane. I like the clause well. I wonder how it
was omitted before. It might have done as well as the clause
for imposition. That gentleman might have thought of it.
It was an ill wipe to Mr. Grove who brought in the Declaration; but was a base thing, in that Sir Henry Vane was
also of that Committee, (fn. 8) and might as well have looked to
that clause to be inserted.
There was added a clause to that purpose.
Mr. Charlton. I would have a clause added, to mourn
for the contradictory oaths. A sad thing, if all oaths should
be written in a paper, that a man has taken upon every imposition !
Mr. Salway seconded the motion.
Mr. Hewley. Those oaths were but personal and temporal. Let us have no retrospect; but look forward, to prevent
it for the future.
Sir Anthony Ashley Cooper. This is a matter of that consequence, that it ought not to be passed by without your notification. (fn. 9)