Mr. Alderman Perry presents the West India Merchants Petition upon the Spanish Depredations.
Wednes. March 3. Mr. Alderman Perry presented to the House,
a Petition of divers Merchants, and Planters, and others, trading to, and interested in the British Plantations in America,
on behalf of themselves and many others, setting forth that Application was made to this House, in the Year 1728, against
the many unjust Seizures and Depredations, that had, for
several Years preceding, been committed by the Spaniards
in America upon his Majesty's Subjects, whilst they were
carrying on their fair and lawful Trade in those Parts; upon
which Application, this House came to a Resolution, 'That
from the Peace, concluded at Utrecht, in the Year 1713,
to this Time, The British Trade and Navigation to and
from the several British Colonies in America, has been
greatly interrupted by the continual Depredations of the
Spaniards, who have seized very valuable Effects, and unjustly taken and made Prize of great Numbers of British
Ships and Vessels in those Parts, to the great Loss and
Damage of the Subjects of this Kingdom, and in manifest
Violation of the Treaties subsisting between the two
Crowns:' And that this House was pleased humbly to address his Majesty thereupon; and that the Spaniards continuing their Depredations on the British Subjects, and no Satisfaction having been obtained for those before committed,
a farther Application was made to this House, in the Year
1730, complaining of the great Interruptions given by the
Spaniards to the Trade and Navigation of this Kingdom, and
their cruel Treatment of the British Subjects; and that this
House, having again taken this Matter into their Consideration, and examined into the same with the utmost Deliberation, came to a Resolution: "That an humble Address be
presented to his Majesty, that he will be graciously pleased
to continue his Endeavours to prevent the Depredations of
the Spaniards, for the future; to procure full Satisfaction
for the Damages already sustained; and to secure to the
British Subjects, the full and uninterrupted Exercise of
their Trade and Navigation to, and from the British Colonies in America.' Which Address was presented to his
Majesty accordingly; and representing to the House, that
the Spaniards have paid so little Regard to his Majesty's most
gracious Endeavours, that they have continued their Depredations, almost ever since the Treaty of Seville, and more
particularly last Year have carried them to a greater Height
than ever; they having arbitrarily seized several Ships, with
their Effects, belonging to his Majesty's Subjects, on the
high Seas, in the destined Course of their Voyages to and
from the British Colonies, amounting to a very considerable
Value; and that the Captains or Masters of some of the said
Ships were, according to the last Advices of the Petitioners, and are (as the Petitioners believe) at this Time
confined by the Spaniards in the West-Indies, and the Crews
are now in Slavery in Old-Spain, where they are most inhumanly treated; and that that cruel Nation make it their
Practice to attack and board all British Merchant Ships,
they meet with in the American Seas, under Pretence of
searching for Goods, which they deem contraband or not,
according to their own arbitrary Will and Pleasure, contrary to the Law of Nations, and in manifest Violation of
the Treaties subsisting between the two Crowns; and that
by these unjust and violent Proceedings of the Spaniards, the
Trade and Navigation to and from America is rendered
very unsafe and precarious; insomuch, that the Insurance
from Jamaica has greatly risen on these Accounts only; and
that, without some speedy and effectual Remedy, the American Trade and Navigation will be (together with the
Revenue of the Crown arising therefrom) very much diminished, if not entirely lost; and farther representing to the
House, that, although his Catholick Majesty has stipulated
by the Treaty of Seville, and by the Declaration of 1732
relative thereunto, to cause Reparation to be forthwith made
to the unhappy Sufferers, yet there is no Instance of its
having been done; so far from it, that, whilst the British
Subjects have been amused with vain and fruitless Hopes of
Satisfaction, the Spaniards have committed farther Insults
and Depredations upon them, and still continue the same
unjust Practices; and that the Cedulas or Orders given by the
Court of Spain to their Governors in America, are only calculated (as the Petitioners by Experience have great Reason
to apprehend) to evade giving Satisfaction to the British Subjects; for there has never been one of the Cedulas complied
with, nor any Governor recalled, nor punished for his Disobedience, as the Petitioners ever heard; and that, for any
Nation to assume the Power of detaining or rummaging the
British Ships upon their lawful Voyages in the American
Seas under Pretence of searching for contraband Goods, is in
Effect (as the Petitioners conceive) claiming and exercising
the sole Sovereignty of those Seas; and that if the
Spaniards be suffered to act in this injurious Manner, to insult the Persons of his Majesty's Subject, or to plunder
them of their Property, the Petitioners apprehend, the same
will be attended, not only with great Obstruction to this
valuable Branch of our Commerce and Navigation, but
also with Consequences very fatal to Great-Britain itself,
and as the Measures hitherto pursued have proved
ineffectual, praying the House to take the Premises into
their mature Consideration, and provide such timely and
adequate Remody, for putting an End to all Insults and Depredations on the British Subjects, as to the House shall seem
meet, as well as procure such Relief for the unhappy Sufferers, as the Nature of their Case, and the Justice of their
Cause require; and that they may be heard by themselves
and Counsel thereupon.
Upon this the Chair said;
Debate upon Form. ; The Chair.
Gentlemen,
'Tho' my Office, while I am in the Chair, deprives me
of having any Share in your Debates, yet it obliges me to
declare what are the Forms of the House. As I conceive
this to be a Point of Form, it is my Duty to acquaint you,
that so far as I have yet observed, it never was the Method
of this House to admit Parties to be heard by themselves and
Counsel. The Motion that is always made in such Cases is,
that the Petitioners be admitted to be heard by themselves or
Counsel. If therefore the honourable Gentleman who
made the Motion, is not satisfied that I put the Question,
Whether it is your Pleasure that the Petitioners be heard
touching the Matter of this Petition by themselves or Counsel, I must beg Leave to take the Sense of the House with
regard to the Terms in which I am to put the Question upon
the present Motion.'
Sir John Barnard standing up, spoke to the following Effect:
Sir John Barnard.
Sir,
'I do not pretend to be so well acquainted with the Forms
of the House, as to give my Opinion whether the Petitioners
ought to be heard by themselves and Counsel, or by themselves or Counsel: But, Sir, I know that this Petition is
founded upon Facts, and I should be sorry to see the Design
of it defeated by a scrupulous Adherence to any Points of
Form whatsoever. The Request of the Petitioners, Sir,
however as to Form it may be extraordinary, yet in Point
of Reason, in my Opinion, is justifiable. Most of the Petitions upon which Counsel is prayed to be heard at the Bar of
this House, are against Bills depending before the House;
and Gentlemen, in the Course of such Bills passing the House,
have Opportunities of making themselves Masters of the
Case; so that the Counsel have little else to do, but to prove
from Facts that the Bill depending is either unjust in itself,
by affecting the Property of the Persons that petition, or by
clashing or being inconsisient with some former Law. But,
Sir, the Case of the present Petitioners is widely different;
the repeated Losses they have met with, and the Injuries they
have sustained in their Trade, can never so well be understood from the Mouth of a Lawyer, as from their own; because, Sir, it is impossible for the ablest Lawyer either to
be so well instructed in the Interests and Claims of the several Petitioners, or to explain the several Terms of Commerce and Navigation that must necessarily occur in this Affair, so as to be understood by Gentlemen unacquainted with
these Matters. Therefore, Sir, I humbly think it will be a
Hardship upon the Petitioners, to deny them a Request of so
little Importance as the present, merely because it interferes
with a Matter of Form. I beg Leave to say, Sir, that
Forms cannot be better known than by Precedents; and I believe it will puzzle any Gentleman to find a Precedent of a
Case parallel to the present, whether we consider the long
Course of Injuries which some of the Petitioners have sustained, the melancholy Situation to which others of them
are reduced, or its Importance to the Trade, the Honour,
and Safety of Britain. Therefore, Sir, I am of Opinion we
ought to make no Difficulty of agreeing to the Request of
the Petition.
This occasioned some Hesitation, and then Sir William
Windham said:
Sir Wm. Windham.
'I think, Sir, that Gentlemen are extremely obliged to
your Care, in putting them in Mind of the usual Form of
Proceeding, and am intirely of your Opinion with regard to
the present Motion. I believe no Gentleman here can suspect that I have not as warm a Sense of the Injuries our
Merchants have sustained, as any Gentleman here; but, Sir,
I think we ought to proceed in a parliamentary Method, and
not make any Innovations in our Forms, except where it is
absolutely necessary. For my own Part, Sir, in the present
Case, I judge it is so far from being absolutely necessary,
that it would do the Petitioners a Prejudice. As to what my
honourable Friend mentioned about a Counsel's not being
able to put mercantile Affairs in such a Light as to be thoroughly understood by Gentlemen, I am intirely of his Opinion; but then I think the Petitioners ought to appear at
our Bar not as Counsel, but as Evidences for themselves. This,
Sir, will effectually answer all the Ends that my honourable
Friend proposes, and will preserve our Method of Proceeding
in its ordinary Form—If therefore, Sir, the Counsel shall
advance a Fact that requires Proof, or touches upon a Point
that wants Explanation, I think it is highly just that the Petitioners should be admitted as Evidences, and be allowed to
answer such Questions as shall be proposed either by Gentlemen, or by their Counsel. This, I conceive, Sir, is but
fair, and would inspire our Merchants with a Confidence in
the Justice of this House, and let the World see that we are
resolved to leave no Means untried which may contribute to
give us right Information, in an Affair that so nearly concerns the Properties of our Fellow Subjects, and the Dignity
of the Nation.'
Sir Robert Walpole spoke next, to the following Purpose.
Sir Robert Walpole.
Sir,
'I must humbly beg leave to differ in my Sentiments on
this Affair, from both the honourable Gentlemen. The Judgment, Sir, which, in my Opinion, we should form in this
Case, ought to be grounded on Facts as they are fairly represented, not as they are artfully aggravated. Every Gentleman, Sir, I believe, from his bare Reflection on the Injuries our Merchants have received from Spain, feels within
his own Breast an Indignation arise, which there is no Occasion to increase by the Power of Eloquence, or the Arts of a
Lawyer. When Gentlemen, Sir, see an Affair through the
Mist that Passion throws before their Eyes, it is next to impossible they should form a just Judgment. I believe there is
scarce any Gentleman here who is not acquainted with as
much Geography, and as much of the History, both of
Britain and Spain, as may enable him, from a plain Representation of Facts, to judge whether the Allegations in this
Petition be true or false. Now, Sir, are not the Merchants
themselves the most proper Hands for giving in such a Representation? Are they not most immediately interested in
the Facts? Where then is the Necessity, Sir, of having Counsel to do this? Or what Occasion, Sir, is there to work upon the Passions where the Head is to be informed? I believe,
Sir, every Gentleman will find his Heart as much affected
by the artless Accounts of the Sufferers themselves, as by the
studied Rhetorick of the most eloquent Counsel. However,
Sir, I shall not take the Liberty to make any Motion on this
Head, but intirely submit it to Gentlemen's Consideration.'
Alderman Willimot answered in Substance as follows:
Alderman Willimet.
Sir,
'I think the Petitioners ought to have Liberty to be
heard, not only by themselves and Counsel; but if it were
possible that we could indulge them in other Advantages, we
ought to do it. To talk of working upon Passions!—Can
any Man's Passions be wound up to a greater Height, can any
Man's Indignation be more raised than every free-born Englishman's must be, when he reads a Letter which I received
this Morning, and which I have now in my Hand. This Letter,
Sir, gives an Account that seventy of our brave Sailors are
now in Chains in Spain. Our Countrymen in Chains! and
Slaves to Spaniards! Is not this enough, Sir, to fire the Coldest?
Is not this enough, Sir, to rouse all the Vengeance of a national Resentment? And shall we, Sir, fit here debating about Words and Forms, while the Sufferings of our Countrymen call out loudly for Redress?'
The Petition referr'd to a Committee of the whole House.
Ordered that the said Petition be referred to the Consideration of a Committee of the whole House, and that it be an
Instruction to the said Committee that they do admit the said
Petitioners to be heard, if they think fit, by themselves or
Counsel, before the said Committee.
Mr Coster. petition from Bristol.
Mr. Coster, one of the Members for Bristol, then presented to the House a Petition of the Master, Wardens, Assistants, and Commonalty of the Society of Merchant-Adventurers, within the City of Bristol, under their common
Seal, and the same was read; setting forth, that for
some Years past, the British Trade and Navigation, to
and from the British Colonies and Plantations in America,
hath been greatly interrupted and exposed to the continual
Insults and Depredations of the Spaniards in those Seas,
where they have taken and made Prizes of great Numbers of
British Ships and Vessels, in their Passage to and from the
said Colonies and Plantations (several of which did belong
to this Port) to the great Damage of his Majesty's Subjects;
whereby the said valuable Trade is in Danger of being lost;
and that, notwithstanding the Resolutions of this House,
and his Majesty's most gracious Endeavours to obtain for his
Subjects just and reasonable Satisfaction, yet the Spaniards
still continue their Depredations, and have lately taken and
plundered several Ships and Vessels, belonging to this and
other British Ports, and have treated such as have fallen into
their Hands, in a very cruel and barbarous Manner; and
therefore praying the Consideration of the House, and such
timely and adequate Remedy in the Premises, as to this
House shall seem fit.
Order'd to be reffer'd to the Committee.
Ordered, That the said Petition be referred to the Consideration of the Committee of the whole House, to whom the
Petition of divers Merchants, Planters, and others, trading
to, and interested in, the British Plantations in America, on
Behalf of themselves and many others, is referred.
Ordered, That it be an Instruction to the said Committee,
that they do admit the Petitioners to be heard, if they think
fit, by themselves or Counsel, before the said Committee.
Petition of the Owners of the Ann Galley.
Next was presented a Petition of Samuel Bonham, Christopher Astley, Benjamin Weal, and Joseph Crowcher, Owners
of the Ship Ann Galley, Joseph Spackman Master, Burthen
one hundred and thirty Tons, or thereabouts, on Behalf of
themselves, and the Mariners, and Seamen of the said
Ship, and the same was read; setting forth, that the
Petitioners on the 4th of December 1728, and since, have
delivered to his Grace the Duke of Newcastle, one of his
Majesty's principal Secretaries of State, seven Memorials and
Petitions addressed to his Majesty, and four others delivered
at the Council-Board, each Memorial and Petition setting
forth the great Loss and Damage, the Petitioners have received by the unjust Capture and Seizure of their Ship Ann
Galley and her Cargo by the Spaniards on the 13th of June
1728, in her Way from Guinea to Jamaica, after the Pacification between the Crowns of Great Britain and Spain was
not only agreed on, but notified to the respective Governments in the West Indies, the same being notified at Jamaica
the 3d of June, and at Carthagena, in New Spain, the 10th
of the same Month; and the Value of the said Ship and Cargo, with the Freight, &c. hath been attested on the Oaths
of the Master and several of the Officers and People belonging to the said Ship Ann Galley, when taken by the Spaniards, to be worth 10,500 l. Sterling, and upwards, besides
the Loss of Interest for that Sum to this Time, being upwards of nine Years; in all which Memorials and Petitions,
the Petitioners most humbly besought his Majesty's Favour,
Interest, and Protection, in recovering their Loss and Damage from the Spaniards; yet that, notwithstanding his
Majesty's Goodness in endeavouring, by all peaceable Ways
and Methods, to obtain Satisfaction for such their Loss and
Damage, it plainly appears to the Petitioners, that those Cedulas are no more than Delusions and Shews of Justice; for
his Majesty hath been graciously pleased to send several Ships
of War from Jamaica to demand Restitution at St. Jago de
Cuba, and by his Minister Benjamin Keene, Esq; at the
Court of Spain, hath made Demand of the said Ship and
Cargo, or the Value thereof, and hath obtained several Orders from the King of Spain, and his Minister Don Joseph
Pantinho, to his Governor and Royal Officers at St. Jago de
Cuba, one dated at Seville the 28th of December 1730, one
dated the 23d of February 1733, wherein his Catholick
Majesty allows the Ship to be an unjust Capture, and orders
his Governor, &c to cause immediate Restitution to be made,
without making any Reply to those Orders; and that, notwithstanding all this, and contrary, as the Petitioners apprehend, to the second separate Article of the Treaty of Seville,
and those made by his Majesty's Royal Predecessors, and particularly the fourteenth Article of the Treaty of 1670, between
England and Spain, and confirmed by the other Treaties,
particularly that of Utrecht in the Year 1713, by which
fourteenth Article it is stipulated, that, if Justice is denied, or
unreasonably delayed, it shall be lawful for that King, whose
Subjects have suffered, to take any Rules and Methods according to the Law of Nations, until Reparation be made to the
Sufferers; notwithstanding his Majesty's Goodness, no Satisfaction could be obtained; and that therefore on the 17th of
January 1733-4, the Petitioners again addressed his Majesty
in Council, setting forth the Hardness of their Case; and
that his Majesty, by the Advice of his Council, the 21st of
February 1733-4, did signify his Royal Pleasure to his Minister at the Court of Spain, that he, in his Majesty's Name,
represent to the Catholick King, that his Majesty looks upon
himself as obliged, by his Failure of Justice in the West Indies to his Majesty's Subjects, to insist, that the Catholick
King do forthwith cause Reparation to be made to the Petitioners for their Loss and Damage; on which another Order
was forwarded to St. Jago de Cuba, to the Governor and
Royal Officers, to make full Restitution for the said Loss and
Damage; by which the Factors of the Petitioners, about
June 1734, received out of the Royal Chest at St. Jago, two
thousand three hundred and sixty Pieces of Eight, and two
Negro Men, the Value of which doth not exceed 531l. Sterling; and that the Petitioners finding that nothing more is ever
to be expected out of the West-Indies (after nine Years Sollicitation and Expence) as appears by their several Letters,
the Copies of which have from Time to Time, as they came
to Hand, been sent and delivered at the Council Office, and
to the Office of his Grace the Duke of Newcastle; therefore, since his Majesty was graciously pleased to lay the several Memorials and Petitions relating to this unhappy Capture
before the House, the Petitioners on the 24th of March
1736-7, brought their Petition into this House, which was
read, and on a Motion made, was ordered to lie on the Table; but that they have neither received, nor have any probable Expectations to receive, from Old or New Spain farther Satisfaction, than as before mentioned, for this their
great Loss, which is too severe and heavy for them to bear,
and which is attended with this aggravating Circumstance,
that the King of Spain hath agreed, that the Capture was
unjust, and hath ordered Satisfaction to be made, but at a
Place, where Experience shews, by repeated Demands and
Endeavours, it cannot be obtained; and therefore praying
the House to take this their unhappy Case into Consideration,
and grant them such Relief, as to the House shall seem
meet.
Referr'd to the Committee.
Ordered, That the said Petition be referred to the Consideration of the Committee of the whole House, to whom the
Petition of divers Merchants, Planters, and others trading to
and interested in the British Plantations in America, on Behalf of themselves and many others, is referred.
Ordered, That it be an Instruction to the said Committee,
that they do admit the Petitioners to be heard, if they
think fit, by themselves or Council, before the said Committee.
Petition of the Owners of the Robert Galley.
Then was presented a Petition of Edmund Saunders, Henry Tongue, and Richard Farr, of the City of Bristol, Merchants, in Behalf of themselves, Henry Lloyd deceased, the
Insurers, Master, and Mariners of the Ship Robert Galley,
of Bristol, Burthen one hundred and twenty Tons, whereof
Story King was Master, and the same was read;
setting forth, that on the 20th of May 1729, (which
was almost a whole Year after the Pacification between the
Crowns of Great Britain and Spain being not only agreed upon, but notified to the respective Governments in the West
Indies) their said Ship, proceeding on her Voyage from Guinea, by the Way of Barbadoes, to Jamaica, was taken on
the Coast of Hispaniola, six Leagues out at Sea, by a Spanish
Guarda la Costa, and, as the Petitioners presume, contrary
to the Law of Nations and Treaties then subsisting, and the
Ship and Cargo carried into St. Domingo, and there condemned as Prize; the Value of which, with Freight, &c.
when taken, as attested upon Oath by the Master, was
10,664 l. Sterling, and upwards, besides the Interest thereof
for near nine Years; and that Admiral Stewart, when he
was Commander in Chief of his Majesty's Ships of War stationed at Jamaica, on Notice of taking of the said Ship and
Cargo, sent his Majesty's Ship the Trial to St. Domingo, to
demand Restitution; but that the Commander of her received
for Answer, that the Ship and Cargo had been condemned
by the Audience, and there could be no Redress, unless obtained in old Spain; and that the Petitioners, having made
Application to his Majesty by Petition in November 1729,
complaining of the unjust Capture of the said Ship Robert;
and begging his Majesty's most gracious Interposition, that
Justice and Restitatition might be done them; but receiving no
Satisfaction, and the Spaniards continuing their Depredations,
the Petitioners joined in a Petition with other Merchants of
Bristol to this House in 1730, and then, as they conceived,
proved the Allegations thereof, when this House thought fit
to address his Majesty, that he would be graciously pleased to
continue his Endeavours to prevent the Depredations of the
Spaniards for the future, and to procure full Satisfaction for
the Damages sustained; whereupon, Commissaries were appointed, by Virtue of the Treaty of Seville; and that the
Petitioners having made Application to them, as well as to
Mr. Keene his Majesty's Minister at the Court of Madrid,
by a Memorial setting forth and authenticated Papers annexed thereto, proving the Unjustness of the Capture of the said
Ship, and the Loss sustained; which was delivered to his
Grace the Duke of Newcastle, about the Month of July
1731; but that, no Relief being had thereupon, the Petitioners again petitioned his Majesty in the Month of September last; which was also delivered to his said Grace, and has
been since transmitted to Mr. Keene; but no Answer being
returned thereto, there is no Probability or Expectation of receiving any Satisfaction; and therefore praying the House,
as the Measures hitherto pursued have proved ineffectual,
to take the Premises into farther Consideration, and grant
such Relief, as to the House shall seem meet, and that the
Petitioners may be heard by themselves and Counsel thereupon.
Referr'd to the Committee.
Ordered, That the said Petition be referred to the Consideration of the Committee of the whole House, to whom
the Petition of divers Merchants, Planters, and others, trading to, and interested in, the British Plantations in America on Behalf of themselves, and many others, is referred.
Ordered, That it be an Instruction to said Committee;
that they do admit the Petitioners to be heard, if they
think fit, by themselves or Counsel, before the said Committee.
Mr. Pulteney.
Mr. Pulteney. ; Moves for a Call of the House on the 16th Instant.
Sir,
'We have now before us an Affair, in which, tho' it is
solicited by the Merchants only of one Denommation, yet
there is not a Merchant in Great Britain who, in some Degree or other, may not be said to be concerned. It is not,
Sir, as has been suggested, an impotent Clamour of a few
Smugglers, whose Effects have been justly sequestered for
carrying on an illicit Trade; but an humble and a just Re
monstrance of a very considerable Body of the best Friend
both to the Interest and Constitution of their Country. It
would wrong the Honour and Justice of this House, Sir, to
suspect, that if the Petitioners prove the Allegations contained in their several Petitions, they shall not receive all
the Relief that it is in our Power to give. But, Sir, there
are other Places where an effectual Redress for their Injuries
must be solicited. I shall not, Sir, go about to accuse any
one before I am certain that the Allegations exhibited in the
Petitions are true; but one Petition that has been now read,
makes a very extraordinary Impression upon me. The Petitioners, Sir, pretend that the King of Spain's Officers in
America have dared to disobey the most positive Orders
obtained from their Master at his Majesty's Instances. Can
any Gentleman, Sir, imagine, that the Spanish Officers durst
have acted in this Manner without the Connivance of their
Court? or that their Court would have presumed to trisle in
such a Manner with any Ministry, but one which they
thought wanted either Courage or Inclination to resent such
Treatment? As I said before, Sir, I shall not take upon
me to give my Judgment of the Affair till I have heard the
Allegations in this Petition made out. If they cannot be
made out, Sir, I think the Petitioners deserve the Censure of
this House for so gross an Imposition. But if they are
proved, Sir, which I think we have too good Reason to
expect, I cannot help saying, that I think our Ministry
have been guilty of a scandalous Breach of Duty, and the
most infamous Pusillanimity. In the mean Time, Sir, as
the Affair itself has on all Sides been confessed of the
greatest Importance, and it is highly requisite that every
Gentleman, who has the Honour to fit in this House, should
be present while it is in Agitation, I think, Sir, we ought
to subject every one, who is absent without indispensible
Necessity, to the severest Censure we can inflict: Therefore I
humbly move, that the House be called over on the 16th of
this Month.
The honourable Henry Pelham, Esq;
Mr. Pelham.
Sir,
'I do not rise up to oppose, but to second the honourable
Gentleman's Motion; and, Sir, as he has been pleased to
give us his Thoughts upon this Affair as it now appears to
him, I hope I may be indulged in the same Liberty. It is
a Liberty, Sir, which I should not have asked, were I not
apprehensive, that if something is not said with regard to
what fell from the honourable Gentleman, it might too
much anticipate the Judgment which Gentlemen may form
upon the present Affair. I have, Sir, heard of the Case
which the honourable Gentleman has hinted at, and I do
not doubt of the Truth of the Allegations contained in the
Petition. But, Sir, supposing them true, how do they affect the Characters of those concerned in the Ministry? Must
the King of Spain, or his British Majesty's Ministers be answerable for the Conduct of their Governors in America,
and for every wrong Construction which these Governors
may make of the Orders they receive from their Principals?
It appears upon the Face of one of the Petitions, that our
Ministry were as active as Men could be in demanding Satisfaction for the Petitioners. If their Instances had not the
desired Effect, the Blame cannot be laid at their Door; for
upon the delaying of Justice, one of these two Ways must
have been taken: They must either have acted as they have
done, or declared Hostilities must have commenced betwixt
the two Crowns. Now, Sir, I believe, the Gentlemen who
talk so much of entering on this Affair with Vigour, would
have been cautious, had they been Ministers, of engaging
in a War upon the Transaction of a single Governor or Officer, contrary to the Will and Intention of his Sovereign.
If upon the Representations that were made by his Majesty's
Ministers at the Court of Spain, the Spanish Ministers had
answered that the Capture was just, and they were resolved
to seize all other British Ships trading in the same Manner:
This, Sir, being looked upon as the Sense of their Court,
might have afforded very good Grounds for a Rupture. But
it appears, Sir, from the Petition, that the Thing was
quite otherwise, and that the Ministry were only blameable
for not attacking the Court of Spain, because his Officers
either did not understand, or would not obey his Orders.
I agree with the honourable Gentleman, as to the Necessity
of our making a strict Enquiry into this Affair; and I
think the Motion he has made is highly reasonable. But,
Sir, I believe that Enquiry will produce a different Effect
from what is expected by the honourable Gentleman. I
have Reason, Sir, to be confident, that it is the Interest of the
Ministry we should examine the Allegations contained in
these Petitions; for I am persuaded, that thereby they must
be cleared from every Imputation of acting either a cowardly
or a negligent Part; and let the Blame fall where it will, I
dare say it cannot justly fall upon them.'
Motion agreed to.
Upon this the Motion was agreed to; but the Call of the
House was put off when the Day appointed came, because it
was rightly judged, that when the Call was over, many Members would drop off; whereas, if it was delayed from Day
to Day, it would be a Method to detain them in Town.
After dispatching some private Bills, Sir John Barrnard
spoke to the following Purpose:
Sir John Barnard moves for the Instruction relating to the Negotiations with Spain.
Sir,
'As the Petitions now presented to us have been so unanimously referred to a Committee of the whole House, and
a proper Day appointed for taking them into Consideration,
I make no doubt of our entering seriously into an Examination of the Grievances complained of; but, as those Grievances are of a foreign Nature, as they are Grievances which
have been long complained of, and as they are Grievances
our Government, we know, have endeavoured to get redressed, have applied to the proper Court for that Purpose,
I must be of Opinion, that we cannot examine thoroughly as
we ought to do, into this Affair, without having before us
the whole Thread of that long Negotiation which has been
carried on with the Court of Spain, for obtaining Redress in
an amicable and peacable Manner.
'The Abuses complained of by the Petitions now before
us are, I must say, Sir, of a most extraordinary Nature:
They are such as the most pitiful Prince in the World would
not suffer from the most powerful, without taking the first
Opportunity for shewing his Resentment. By these Petitions
we are told, that the Spaniards have not only seized our Ships,
with their Effects, in a most arbitrary Manner, but that they
have inhumanly treated our Seamen. Nay, we are told,
that with respect to one Ship in particular, though the
Court of Spain itself has acknowledged her being wrongfully and injuriously seized, yet they have hitherto refused or
delayed making any proper Reparation, notwithstanding its
being now almost ten Years since the Ship was seized, and
near eight Years since the Court of Spain itself acknowledged
the Injustice of the Seizure.
'But why should I talk, Sir, of what has been done eight
or ten Years ago, or but lately? These Insults and Abuses
have been continued, I may say without Interruption, ever
since his late Majesty's Accession to the Crown, which is
near twenty-four Years since. This is not the first Time that
our Merchants have been obliged to sue to this House for
Redress in this Affair. In the Year 1728 we may remember that Application was made to this House, against the
many unjust Seizures and Depredations, that bad, for several
Years preceding, been committed by the Spaniards in America upon his Majesty's Subjects, whilst they were carrying on
their fair and lawful Trade in those Parts; and upon that
Application, this House came then to a Resolution, 'That
from the Peace of Utrecht in 1713 to that Time, the British
Trade and Navigation to and from the several British Colonies in America, had been greatly interrupted by the continual Depredations of the Spaniards, who had seized very
valuable Effects, and unjustly taken and made Prize of great
Numbers of British Ships and Vessels, in those Parts, to the
great Loss and Damage of the Subjects of this Kingdom, and
in manifest Violation of the Treaties subsisting between the
two Crowns: Upon which Resolution an Address was presented to his Majesty,' Beseeching him to use his Endeavours
for obtaining Satisfaction and Security for our Merchants.
But what was the Consequence? The Spaniards not only refused Satisfaction, but continued their Depredations; and
therefore a new Application was made to this House, and a
new Address prefented to his Majesty by this House, in the
Year 1730, which must now appear to have had as little
Effect as the former, if the Facts charged in the Petitions
now before us shall, upon Examination, be found true.
'After having thus stated the Case in its proper and true
Light, I must take notice, Sir, that when we go into a Committee upon this Affair, the first Thing we enquire into, is,
to know whether the Facts, as represented in the Petitions,
are true; for which Purpose we must examine the Petitioners, and such Witnesses, or other Vouchers, as they shall
please to bring or lay before us. This we must certainly do;
but when we have done this, we shall have heard only one
Side of the Question; for, surely the Spaniards have some
Pretence for what they have done, or something to say in
their own Vindication. As there is no War, nor has been
for several Years, between the two Nations, they would not
certainly have seized any one Ship belonging to British Subjects, without some Pretence for so doing; and from the
Wisdom, the Penetration, and the Courage of our present
Ministers, I must conclude, that those Pretences were such as
carried some Shew or Colour of Reason; because if it had
been otherwise, I am convinced, our Ministers would have
advised declaring War against them long before this Time.
These Pretences therefore we must examine into, before we
can come to any proper or just Resolutions with respect to
this Affair; and these Pretences we cannot examine into
without having before us all the Letters, Memorials, and other Papers, that have passed between the two Courts upon
this Subject.
'If the Facts set forth in the Petitions be found to be true,
and exactly as represented; and if the Pretences made use of
by the Spaniards for treating our Merchants and Seamen in
such a thievish and barbarous Manner, be found to be frivolous
and groundless; the next Thing we are to inquire into, is, how
it comes that no Satisfaction has yet been obtained, and what
Prospect we now have of obtaining Satisfaction? For in such
Cases there are but three Ways of obtaining Satisfaction,
which are, either by Negociation, by declaring War, or by
a middle Way between these two, I mean that of granting
Letters of Marque or Reprisal to such of our Subjects as have
been injured. The first we have certainly tried; and if that
should be now in such Forwardness as that a proper Satisfaction
may, in all Probability, be soon expected, I should be against
this House's coming to any Resolution at present, lest it
might disturb or interrupt the Course of that Negotiation;
but this we cannot enquire into, without having before us
those Letters, Memorials, and other Papers, that have lately,
or indeed those that have last passed between the two Courts
upon this Subject. In this Case, I say, Sir, I should be against our coming to any present Resolution; but if it should
appear, that we have now no Hopes of obtaining Satisfaction or Security in a peaceable Manner, I must think it would
be very proper for us to inquire into what Prospect we ever
had of obtaining Redress by Way of Negotiation; for considering that our Negotiations for this Purpose have continued, or at least ought to have continued, for above these
twenty Years, I cannot but be of Opinion, that we have
been bamboozled with fair Promises; and in that Case I do
not know but it may be thought proper to inquire into the
Nature of those Promises, in order to know whether they
were such as a prudent Man ought to have depended on; because if they were of such a Nature, or so often broken, as
that no prudent Man would have depended on them, I am
sure it ought to stir up the Resentment of this Nation against
some other Persons, as well as against the Spaniards. This
likewise is a Piece of Knowledge which we cannot come at,
without having before us all those Letters, Memorials, and
other Papers, that have passed between the two Courts, relating to the Depredations, Insults, and Cruelties now complained of.
'I think I have now shewn, Sir, that we cannot seriously
and thoroughly examine into the Grievances complained of in
the Petitions now before us, or come to any proper Resolutions for obtaining Redress, without having before us the
whole Thread of the Negotiation between Spain and us, relating to the Depredations committed by the Subjects of Spain
upon those of Great-Britain; but before I make any Motion for this Purpose, I must beg leave to observe, that this
very Affair has occasioned many Complaints among our
People, not only against the Spaniards, but against our present Administration. Those Merchants and Seamen who
have been plundered and abused, and have been at so much
Trouble, and so great an Expence of Time and Money, in
applying for Redress both at the Court of Great Britain, and,
by Encouragement and Recommendation from thence, at the
Court of Spain, are apt to think, that both the Honour and
Interest of their Country lie neglected and forgot. Nay,
this Opinion prevails too much, not only among those who
are the Sufferers, but also among their Friends and Acquaintance, and I am afraid, among all those who have heard or
read of these often-repeated Depredations. This Opinion
not only renders our People discontented with our Administration, but, what is of much worse Consequence, it may
render our People disaffected towards his Majesty and his illustrious Family; and it must be confessed, that Gentlemen
who are no way acquainted with the Secrets of our publick
Transactions for several Years past, do not well know what
to say to those who thus complain, or how to make an Excuse
for the many Losses, Disappointments, and Delays our Merchants have met with.
'This Inability which most Gentlemen in the Kingdom
are under, must be a real Grief to all those who have a true
Regard for his Majesty, or for the Royal Family. This, Sir,
of: itself is, in my Opinion, a sufficient Argument for Genlemen's being desirous to examine into the late Negociations,
that have passed between Spain and us. I hope every Gentleman will from thence see, that every thing has been done
for obtaining Satisfaction for past Injuries, and Security against future, that could be done by a wise King and a disinterested Administration. From thence every Gentleman
will be able to give a satisfactory Answer to all those who
think they have Reason to complain; by which Means, Disaffection will be prevented, and those Discontents, which I
am afraid fall heavily at present upon our own Administration, will then, I hope, be all converted into a just Resentment against the Shuffling, and repeated Breaches of
Faith, which the Spaniards have been guilty of. This, I say,
Sir, will, I hope, be the Consequence of having these Papers laid before us; but whatever may be the Consequence
with respect to those who have been entrusted with our Administration, I am sure every Gentleman will see, and from
thence will be able to convince others, that his Majesty has all
along acted the most prudent Part, according to the Information he has had from Time to Time; which will of
Course remove every Ground of Disaffection; and this is
what, I am sure, the Majority of this House have chiefly, if
not solely, at Heart; for the Majority of this House will, I
hope, always have a much greater Concern for vindicating
the Honour of their Sovereign, than for screening or concealing the Faults of any of his Ministers, either abroad or at
home.
'In full Confidence of this, Sir, I presume the Motion I
am to make will be unanimously agreed to, and therefore I
shall add no more, but move:
The Motion.
"That an humble Addreses be presented to his Majesty;
that he would be graciously pleased to give Directions for
laying before the House Copies or Extracts of the several
Petitions, Representations, Memorials, and all other Papers
relating to the Spanish Depredations upon the British Subjects;
which had been presented to his Majesty, or delivered to
either of his Majesty's principal Secretaries of State since
Midsummer last; together with Copies, or Extracts of such
Memorials or Representations, as had been made either to the
King of Spain or his Ministers; and the Answers returned
by them to the same; and together with Copies, or Extracts
of the Letters written to his Majesty's Minister at Madrid,
with the Answers received from him relating to the said Depredations."
This Motion being seconded by Mr. Alderman Perry, Sir
Robert Walpole rose, and spoke to the following Purpose:
Sir R. Walpole.
Sir,
'I do not stand up to oppose the honourable Gentleman's
Motion, because there are many Papers have passed between
the Courts of Great-Britain and Spain, relating to the Subject of Complaint now before you, which it may be proper
for the Committee to see; but there are certainly some
which you ought not as yet to call for; and therefore I must
think the Motion rather too general and extensive; for tho'
we have a full and unlimited Power of addressing for whatever
we may think proper, yet we ought never to desire any
Thing but what the Crown may probably be able to comply
with, without doing an Injury to the publick Affairs of the
Nation.
'I am sure it cannot be supposed, Sir, that I have any
Objection, on my own particular Account, against calling
for any Letters, Memorials, or other Papers, that have
been contrived and drawn up by the Court of Spain: I am no
Minister at that Court, nor can it be said that I have the
least Influence on any of their Councils; and therefore I
cannot be made to answer for any Step they have been pleased
to take, relating to the Thing now before us. If I had had
the least Influence on any of their Councils, I am sure I
would have advised them, even for their own Sakes, to have
observed a very different Sort of Conduct with respect to this
Nation. In my Opinion, if the Spaniards were governed by
prudent Councils, if their publick Affairs were under the
Management of those who had nothing else in View but the
true Interest of that Kingdom, they would find it as much
their Interest to avoid picking Quarrels with us, as it is our
Interest to avoid picking any Quarrel with them. They
would have long since found, and they may probably at last
find, to their Cost, that their own Proverb will always hold
true, 'Peace with England, and War with all the World
besides.' This has long ago become a Sort of Proverb in
the Spanish Language, and will always be found to be a just
and a prudent Maxim; for it is the Interest of both Nations
to be well with one another; but Nations have often the
Misfortune to be governed by those, who have nothing less
in View than the Interest of that Country they govern.
'For this Reason, Sir, every Gentleman must allow,
that a War with Spain ought to be avoided if possible; and
as his Majesty has not as yet told us, that he has given over all
Hopes of obtaining Redress by Negociation, we ought to
take no Step, nor call for any Paper, that may render ineffectual, or perhaps put an intire Stop to all future Negociation. We cannot suppose that any Step taken by this
House; or any Paper laid before us, can be kept a Secret,
because there are generally great Numbers of Persons present, besides those who have a Right to be here. This, I
say, can never be supposed; and therefore it has always
been observed as a Rule in our Proceedings, never to call
for any Paper relating to an Affair then in Agitation. The
last Memorial or Answer from Spain is a Paper of this
Nature: It arrived but on Saturday last; and, I believe, I
may venture to acquaint the House, that it is far from being
satisfactory; but if kept private, and no violent Measures
taken in the mean Time, it may be explained so as to render
it satisfactory, by which means an open Rupture will be
prevented: Whereas, if it should be laid before this House,
it may inflame the Nation, or even this House, so much, as
to hurry us into some violent Measures; and even suppose
we should be able to govern our Resentment, yet the
rendering it publick, which would certainly be the Consequence of laying it before us, might make the Court of Spain
think their Honour concerned in adhering peremptorily to
the Terms of this Answer, without giving such Explanations as they might otherwise in prudence be induced to give.
'I shall most readily agree, Sir, that our Merchants and
Seamen have been often treated most unjustly and most inhumanly by the Spanish Guarda Costas, and that both the
Honour and Interest of the Nation are deeply concerned in
obtaining Reparation for past Injuries, and a proper Security against being exposed to any such in Time to come;
but we certainly ought not to have Recourse to Arms as long
as there is any Prospect of obtaining Redress in a peaceable
Manner. It is without Doubt a very popular Way of arguing,
to talk highly of the Honour, the Courage, and the superior
Power of this Nation; and, I believe, I have as good an Opinion of the Honour, Courage, and Power of this Nation, as
any Man can, or ought to have; but other Nations must be
supposed to have Honour as well as we, and all Nations
generally have a great Opinion of their Courage, and Power.
If we should come to an open Rupture with Spain,
we might in all Probability have the Advantage; but
Victory and Success do not always attend upon that Side
which seems to be the most powerful; there fore an open
Rupture, or declared War, between two potent Nations,
must always be allowed to be an Affair of the utmost Importance to both; and as this may be the Consequence of our
present Deliberations, we ought to proceed with great Coolness, and with the utmost Caution.
Prudence and Pusillanimity, Sir, are two Words which are
easily understood in private Life; but in publick Life, and in
national Affairs, it is not so easy to sorm proper Ideas for these
two Words, and to determine the exact Boundaries between
them. If a private Man should think his Honour injured,
he may, he ought to resent it immediately; because, as he
has nothing but his own Life to lose, his own Opinion is a
good and a sufficient Reason for putting it to the Venture:
But in national Quarrels the Lives of many Thousands are
concerned; and those who are to deliberate and determine in
what Manner, or how soon, an Injury ought to be resented,
are generally those whose Lives, in Case of a Rupture, will
be the last of being brought into Danger. For this Reason,
they ought not to depend so much on their own Opinion; nor
ought they to insist upon such Punctilio's as may be insisted
on in private Life. They ought to consider the Circumstances
of both Nations, and they ought to weigh thoroughly the
probable Consequences; for it may sometimes be the Interest
of a Nation to pocket an Affront, or at least to defer their
Resentment, till they find a more proper Opportunity for
taking Vengeance. This is what we cannot be competent
Judges of, even though we had all the Papers now moved
for before us; because from them we could not guess how we
stand with respect to the other Powers of Europe. We
could not from thence know, but that our coming to an immediate Rupture with Spain might unite several Powers
against us; and, in that Case, surely, it would be Madness
in us to call for any Paper, or to make any Step, which might
hasten that Rupture.
'From this Consideration it must appear, Sir, that even
with respect to a Nation, whose Friendship we have no Reason to be fond of, it may not at all Times be proper to shew
an immediate Resentment; but with respect to a Nation
whose Friendship we have Reason to be fond of, and not only a Nation we ought to endeavour to be well with, but likewise a Nation whose real Interest it is to cultivate a Friendship with us, we certainly ought not to be quick in shewing
our Resentment, upon every Misunderstanding that may happen between us. If such a Nation should be hurried into
wrong Measures with respect to us, either by the particular
Circumstances they happen to be in, or perhaps, by weak or
treacherous Councils, there may be many Reasons for our
delaying to shew a proper Resentment; because the Circumstances they are in may alter, or they may come to be governed by more prudent or more upright Councils, in which
Case they will court a Reconciliation, and for that Purpose
will be glad to make us all the Reparation they have in their
Power. This will certainly be the Case with Spain, as soon
as they begin to consider seriously, and to pursue solely that
which is the true Interest of the Spanish Nation in general.
The present Misunderstandings between us, would then be
easily and speedily removed; whereas if we should hurry ourselves into a War with that Nation, the Violences, Rapines,
and Massacrees, which would be committed on both Sides,
might establish a Sort of national Enmity and Hatred between
the People of the two Kingdoms, which both Courts, if they
were never so well inclined to each other, might find difficult to remove for many Years after.
'For this Reason, Sir, we ought to avoid as much as
possible coming to an open Rupture with that Nation in particular; and, therefore, I do not know any great Necessity
there is for our calling for any Papers; for I do not think
we can come to any Resolution upon the present Occasion,
except that of addressing his Majesty to take those Measures
which he may, in his great Wisdom, think most prudent
and necessary, for obtaining Redress to his injured Subjects.
I hope no Gentleman will think, that this House ought to
declare War against Spain, or that we ought to advise
his Majesty to declare War, till he applies to us for our Advice upon that Head. Such a Proceeding would not only
be an Incroachment upon one of the most certain Prerogatives of the Crown, but it would likewise be a Sign of great
Rashness and Imprudence; for no Man can prudently give
his Advice for declaring War, without knowing the whole
System of the Affairs of Europe as they stand at present, and
how the several Potentates of Europe now stand affected towards one another. It is not the Power of Spain, and the
Power of this Nation only; that we ought in such a Case to
consider and compare: We ought likewise to know what
Allies our Enemies may have, and what Assistance we may
expect from our Friends; neither of which we can know
from the Papers now moved to be called for, if they were all
laid before us; therefore we must leave it entirely to his
Majesty, to take the most prudent Measures for obtaining
Redress; and, when his Majesty finds that no peaceable
Measures will prevail, he will without doubt apply to this
House for Advice as well as Assistance; and, will then certainly give the House all the Information that may be necessary for giving us a full View of our Circumstances both
abroad and at home.
'From what I have said, Sir, I hope Gentlemen will be
of Opinion, that we can come to no Resolution upon the
present Occasion, but that of addressing his Majesty in much
the same Terms this House has heretofore done upon a like
Occasion; and this, I am convinced, every Gentleman will
think we may do, without having before us any of the Answers from the Court of Spain, especially that which arrived only on Saturday last. There is, therefore, not the
least Occasion for our calling for that Paper; if we do, we
may have Reason to repent it; but, I am sure we can never
have Occasion to repent our not calling for it; because, we
may hereafter have that, and every other Paper relating to
the Affair now in Hand, laid before us; and, if any of his
Majesty's Ministers, either abroad or at home, have been to
blame, or have injured the Nation by their Ignorance or
Neglect, or by any criminal Step, in the Course of these
Negociations, it will then appear; and the Person guilty may
be punished according as the House shall then see just; for
no one of his Majesty's Ministers either does, or can expect
to have his Failing skreened or concealed by a British House
of Commons; I hope no one of them has any Occasion for
such Skreening or Concealment.
'As for the Discontents that may be in the Nation, on
Account of the Depredations committed by the Spaniards, I
cannot think that any of them are directed against the Administration; I am sure they cannot with any Justice be so directed; and therefore, I am convinced, that none of them are
so directed by any Person who is not disaffected to his Majesty, as well as discontented with the Administration. But
I hope most of them are levelled where they ought only to
be levelled; I mean against the Spaniards, who have been
guilty of, or have connived at, those Depredations; for even
from the Papers we have already seen, I must be of Opinion,
that our Ministers, both abroad and at home, have been at
as much Pains as it was possible for them to be at, and have
used all proper Means for convincing the Court of Spain of
their Error, and for prevailing with them to make full Reparation. This, I say, I am convinced of from the Papers
now upon our Table, which in my Opinion may furnish any
willing Mind with Matter sufficient, not only for vindicating
his Majesty's Government from any Aspersion that may be
cast upon it by the Disaffected, but also for vindicating the
Measures pursued by the Administration. With respect to
his Majesty's Government, tho' there are some without Doors
who, for the Sake of spreading Disaffection, are ready to impute the most casual Misfortunes, to some Fault or Neglect
in his Government; yet I am sure there is no Gentlemen
within Doors, who will not be ready to vindicate it upon
every Occasion; but with respect to the Administration, I
cannot say so much: I am afraid there are some within Doors
as well as without, who are not very willing to vindicate it upon any Occasion, and who upon most Occasions are even unwilling to admit of those Excuses, which the Administration
may justly lay claim to.
'As I do not oppose calling for any Papers, in which our
Administration can be supposed to have a Concern, I hope,
what I have said, Sir, will have the more Weight. If I
opposed calling for any Papers that have been penned or advised by any of our Ministers, it might perhaps be suspected
that my Opposition proceeded from some selfish End, in
order to prevent an Enquiry into my own Conduct, or into
the Conduct of some of my Friends; but as I oppose calling
for some of those Papers only, which have been penned and
advised by the Ministers of Spain, I cannot think my Opposition will be liable to any such Suspicion; I hope it will be
thought, I have nothing but the Good of my Country in
View. I really think, and I protest I speak it sincerely, I
say, I really think it inconsistent with the Interest of the
Nation, to call for any Paper so lately arrived, as the last
Dispatch which came from the Court of Spain to this Court.
It may be attended with terrible Consequences, not only in
the Case now before us, but in many future Cases, because
it will be a dangerous Precedent for all Time to come. Who
knows, Sir, should we make a Precedent of this, but that a
future House of Commons may assume to themselves a Power
of calling for Papers during the Dependance of a Negociation; and if this should ever come to be our Case, I am sure
no foreign Prince or State will ever enter into any secret Negociation or Treaty with our Government, the Consequences of
which I shall leave to every Gentleman to form to himself a
Notion of; for they are beyond what I can pretend to express.
'I am far from thinking, Sir, that a Negative ought to
be put upon the Motion the honourable Gentleman has
been pleased to make; but from what I have said, I hope
even he himself will be convinced, that his Motion ought to
be confined, and that therefore he will agree to the Amendment I am to propose; for in the Affair now before us, it
will be a great Advantage to the Nation, and therefore I
wish, that we may proceed in every Step with the greatest
Concord and Unanimity. The Amendment I propose is,
That those Words which relate to the answers from Spain
may be all left out; and in that Case the latter Part of the
Motion will run thus: 'Together with Copies or Extracts
of such Memorials or Representations, as had been made,
either to the King of Spain, or his Ministers; and of the
Letters written to his Majesty's Minister at Madrid relating
to the said Depredations.'
Mr. Pulteney spoke next.
Mr. Pulteney.
Sir,
'The Motion made by my honourable Friend over the
Way, is not only so just in itself, but so much calculated
for vindicating the Conduct of the honourable Gentleman
who spoke last, that I wonder to hear him oppose calling
for any Papers, or any one Paper, that can be supposed to
have the least Relation to the Subject of Complaint now under our Consideration. If I were to advise him, and I speak
it with the utmost Sincerity, I would advise him, for his own
Sake, as well as for the Sake of the Nation, to advise laying
the Affair fully before the Parliament, in order to have the
Advice of Parliament upon such an important Occasion.
We have in this Kingdom several Councils; we have
a Privy Council; a Cabinet Council; and, for what I
know, a more secret and less numerous Council still, by
which the other two are directed: But the Parliament is his
Majesty's great and chief Council: It is the Council which
all Ministers ought, both for their own Sakes and their Masters, to advise his Majesty to consult with, upon every Affair of great Weight and Importance; for, from all our
Histories we shall find, that those Kings have been the
most happy and glorious, who have often consulted with
their Parliaments; and that those Ministers have always gone
through their Administration with the greatest Ease and Applause, and have divested themselves of their Power with
the greatest Safety to themselves, which seldom happens to
any but those who have advised their Masters to depend chiefly
upon the Advice of their Parliaments.
'In our Privy Council, Sir, in our Cabinet Council, and
in any more secret Council, if there be any such, the honourable Gentleman may be supposed to have a Sway; nay,
it may be even suspected that he has, under his Majesty, the
chief Direction of each; and therefore he may, some Time
hereafter, be made to answer for their Determinations; but it
cannot be suspected that he has the Direction of either House
of Parliament, nor are we to presume that he has any other
Sway in this House, but that which proceeds either from the
Solidity and Strength of his Arguments, or from his superior Art
of Persuasion: For which Reason he can never be made to
answer for any Resolution of Parliament, or for any Thing
that is done pursuant to the Advice of Parliament. In all
Cases therefore he ought to be fond of having the Advice, or
at least the Approbation, of an independant and free Parliament; but more particularly in a Case such as the present,
where the most prudent Councils may not be always attended
with the wished-for Success. In such Cases, I say, more
particularly, he ought in common Prudence to chuse and
desire, that his Conduct should proceed from the Advice and
the Resolutions of Parliament; because, whatever may be
the Event, he cannot be made to answer for our Conduct,
nor can he be blamed even by those who judge of Things
only by the Event, which is the Case of the greatest Part of
Mankind, in this as well as every other Country.
'I am very sensible, Sir, the honourable Gentleman is
no Minister in Spain; I believe he has but very little, if any
direct Influence upon that Court; and I am sorry it is so,
because if he had any Power over their Councils, I find he
would have advised them to have acted in a very different
Manner towards us, and in a Manner more consonant to
their own Honour and Interest as well as ours: But yet I
would not have him to depend so much upon his never being
brought to answer for any of those Memorials or Answers,
that have been drawn up, or any of the Measures that have
been pursued by the Court of Spain, because both might,
and, I believe, did very much depend upon the Memorials
or Representations we sent them, and the Measures we pursued; and if by any Fault or Mistake in our Conduct, they
have been induced to send us wrong or evasive Answers, or
to pursue Measures that were contrary to the Honour or the
Interest of this Nation, those who were the Authors and
Advisers of our Conduct towards them, may justly be made to
answer for their Conduct towards us; especially as no Part of
our past Conduct can be said to have proceeded from the Advice, or from the Resolutions of Parliament. When I say
this, Sir, I would not have it thought, that I intend to blame
any Part of our late Conduct towards Spain, or to charge any
Gentleman with having been the Author and Adviser of
that Conduct. This is what neither I nor any Gentleman
can do, till he has fully and thoroughly enquired into the
Affair now before us, and particularly the Papers now called
for.
'The Interests of Trade and our Situation, Sir, makes
a Friendship betwixt this Nation and the Crown of Spain,
to be wished for by every honest Englishman, and
by every true Spaniard; but, Sir, if we have neglected
to cultivate a Friendship with that Nation, or if it
should be found, that we have even wilfully or causelelly
disobliged them, for the Sake of cultivating a Friendship
with other Nations, whose Friendship can never be of any
great Service, but has been still found ruinous to this Nation,
or for the Sake of encouraging or protecting a particular Set
of Men amongst ourselves, I believe it will be generally agreed, that the Authors and Advisers of such a Conduct,
ought to be enquired after by, and ought to fall under the
Censure of, a British Parliament: I believe every Man will
likewise agree, that we cannot in Justice expect Reparation
till we are ready to give it; and that, if we were the first to
offend, we ought to be the first to offer an Attonement. I
am far from thinking that this is the Case, but I am sure it
will be allowed, that it may; and surely, this House can
come to no Resolution, with respect to the Affair before us,
till we know whether this be the Case or not. Now, I would
be glad to know, how it is possible for us to determine,
whether this be the Case or not, till we have seen all the
Memorials, Answers, and other Papers, drawn up by the
Court of Spain upon this Head; for, from these, and these
only, we can acquire a sufficient Knowledge of the Demands
they have upon us, or the Complaints they make against us.
'Tis true, Sir, we cannot presume that any Paper laid
before this House can be long kept a Secret, nor can we tell
whether the last Answer from Spain be a Paper which ought
to be kept secret. The hon. Gentleman has been pleased to
tell us, it is far from being satisfactory; but if I have been
rightly informed, it is something more than dissatisfactory;
I have been told it may even in some Measure be called
Menacing and Insulting. I shall be glad to find I have
been misinsormed. I hope it is, as the honourable Gentleman says, such a one as may admit of an Explanation. But
I am sure, if a Negociation of twenty Years has not been
able to procure a satisfactory answer, or proper Explanations, it is high Time for us to take other Measures; and,
no Measure can be more effectual than an explicit and
strong Resolution of a British Parliament. Such a Resolution
has always hitherto had a great Effect upon the Councils of
most States in the World, especially such as have any Territories bordering upon our Dominion in the Ocean: I hope
it will still have the same Effect; for whatever little Divisions may be amongst us, with respect to our own domestick
Affairs, I am convinced those Divisions will never prevent
our shewing a firm Resolution of being unanimous against
any foreign Power, that shall dare to encroach upon or insult us. Upon such Occasions, I hope, we will always shew
ourselves as ready to support the Honour of our King, as he
is to support the Interest and just Rights of his People.
'It may, Sir, have been generally observed as a Rule in
Parliament, not to enquire into any foreign Affair while it
is upon the Anvil; but, even this Rule is not without Exception, especially if any Affair should be continued too
long upon the Anvil; for its being so, may be a good Reason for a parliamentary Enquiry. But, after either House of
Parliament has resolved to enquire into any Affair, foreign
or domestick, was it ever pretended, that they ought not to
call for every Paper necessary for giving them a full Light
into that Affair? Does not every one know, that it has always been, and always must be, the Custom of this House,
when any Affair is, according to Order, to come before us,
to call for all Papers which we can suppose to have any Relation to that Affair? In such Cases, if among the Papers called for, there be any which ought not, for the Sake of publick Good, to be exposed to publick View, it is the Business of the Crown to tell us so; but, this is an Answer we
ought not to take from any of our own Members, let him
know ever so much of the Secret of Affairs. That, Sir, is a
Knowledge I don't envy him for; but I speak as a Member of
this House, and therefore say that no Gentleman can take upon him to dictate what Papers are proper, and what are unproper for our Inspection. The Answer last arrived from
Spain is certainly a Paper which relates to the Affair we have
resolved to enquire into; it is, in my Opinion, the most
principal Paper, and a Paper without which we cannot come
to any proper Resolutions; therefore we certainly ought
to call for it; and, if it be of such a Nature as that it ought
not yet to be made publick, his Majesty, in his Answer,
will certainly tell us so. When his Majesty has told us. so,
we may then consider, whether it may not be proper for us
to put off an Enquiry into this Affair, till we can have a
Sight of that Paper; but, till we have such an Answer from
the Crown, and from the Crown only it is that this House can
take such an Answer, there cannot, in my Opinion, be any
Colour of Reason for our not calling for a Sight of it. What
the Answer from the Crown may be, I shall not pretend to
guess at; but I must say, I cannot at present suggest to myself any one Reason for thinking that Answer of such a Nature, as that it may not be safely communicated to this
House. If it be merely dissatisfactory, it can neither inflame
nor hurry us into any violent Measures; and, if it be menacing or insulting, it ought to be exposed for that very Purpose. In private Life, a Man may be my Friend, and may
have been so for many Years; but, if once he begins to
menace or insult, from that Moment he ceases to be so; and,
nothing but an abject, sordid Spirit, will patiently submit to such
Treatment, for the Sake of any self-interested View whatever.
'There is therefore, I think, Sir, not the least Foundation for being afraid, lest our Resentment should be
stirred up beyond its just Bounds, by that Paper's being
laid before us; and, us for the Honour of the Court
of Spain, I with some Gentlemen may not have
had both formerly and of late too great a Regard for it: I
wish they may not have sacrificed some of the most substantial Points of English Honour, to some of the most romantick Punctilio's of Spanish Honour. For my Part, I shall
always think, that, in national Affairs, as well as in private
Life, even the Punctilio's of Honour ought to be insisted on,
when we have to do with those who, on their Parts, do insist upon them; for then they become material. But, Sir,
as I shall always have a much greater Regard for the Honour
of this Nation, than for that of any other, if the Court of
Spain, or any other Court in Europe, should entertain such
whimsical Notions of their Honour, as might prevent their
doing Justice to us, I should think it inconsistent with
the Honour of this Nation, not to take such Measures as
might be proper for giving them different Notions, both of
their own Honour and of the Justice that is due to us.
'I am as much averse, Sir, to the involving of this Nation in a War, especially with Spain, as any Gentleman
can be; and therefore, notwithstanding the many Injuries
and Insults we have suffered, I am against coming to an
open Rupture, if there be any reasonable Hopes left of obtaining a proper Redress in a peaceable Manner; but, for
God's sake, Sir, when are these Hopes to be at an End? In
this Respect, I am sure, it cannot be said, but that we have
already hoped sufficiently; we have hoped, and hoped, and
hoped again; but, by what yet appears, we have, I think,
hitherto hoped in vain. What if we should now put a Period to
our pacifick Hopes, and begin to put on other Hopes, I
mean those of acting such a Part as may become a brave
but injured People: It is true, that Means may be fallen
upon to disappoint even those Hopes. Nay, Sir, it is
certain that no Nation can be assured of Success, even in
the justest Quarrel, and supported with the greatest Force;
but will this Uncertainty ever be a Reason with any brave
Man, or powerful Nation, to bear tamely with repeated
Injuries and Insults? When there is a just Cause for War,
we ought certainly to take all prudent and necessary Measures for securing Victory on our Side, and when we have
done so, we must trust the Event to Providence. Now, Sir,
I should be glad to know, whether, in our Deliberations on
this Affair we are to enquire what reasonable Hopes we
may have of obtaining Redress in a peaceable Manner; because, if this be one of the Points that is to fall under our
Consideration, and that it is, I can hardly think any Gentleman will seriously deny, it is absolutely impossible for us
to determine this Question, without seeing the last Answer
from Spain; and therefore, it is absolutely necessary for us
to call for that Answer in particular, if we are seriously resolved to make a thorough Enquiry into this Affair, and to
come to such Resolutions as may be worthy of a British
Parliament.
'Prudence and Pusillanimity, Sir, in private Life, is
what every Gentleman well knows to be widely different,
and even with Respect to national Affairs, are not Words of
such an intricate or unintelligible Nature but that they may
be understood by Parliaments as well as Ministers. Even a
Parliament may avoid Pusillanimity, without running into
rash or precipitate Measures; and if our Cabinett, or any
other of our private Councils, have been guilty of Pasillanimity, our Parliament may correct it by their Prudence. The
Wisdom of Parliament, is the Wisdom of the Nation; and
in all national Affairs of great Importance, surely the
Wisdom of the Nation ought to be consulted. We are not
to conclude, that such a Step must necessarily and unavoidably
throw us into a War; and much less are we to conclude, that
the laying of this last Answer, or any Answer, from Spain,
will necessarily produce such an Effect. On the contrary, a
strict Parliamentary Enquiry into this Affair, may prevent an
open Rupture. The Court of Spain, if it is in the Wrong;
will then see we are serious; they will from thence conclude,
we are no longer to be dallied with, and may probably shew
more Respect to the Interposition of Parliament, than they
have ever shewed to the Negotiations of our Ministers. If
they are not in the Wrong, which may be the Case; for
tho' they have certainly done us many and great Injuries, yet
their having done so, may, for what we know, proceed from
our having first done Injuries to them; and their refusing or
delaying to make Reparation to us, may proceed from our refusing or delaying to make, or so much as to offer, any Reparation to them: If this be the Case, if our Ministers have been
guilty of any Misconduct or unjust Obstinacy in this Respect,
which I am far from suspecting they have, we cannot expect
that they will immediately, and of themselves, acknowledge
their Error, and change their Conduct; but whatever Faults
they may have this Way been guilty of, will certainly, upon
a proper Enquiry, be rectified by the Resolutions of Parliament; so that by laying this Affair fully before Parliament,
a War may be prevented, which would otherwise be unavoidable; but without a thorough Enquiry into the Disputes
between Spain and us from first to last, we cannot discover
whether our Ministers have been guilty of any Misconduct or
unjust Obstinacy, and consequently can come to no proper
Resolutions for rectifying their Mistakes; and I am sure,
without seeing every Paper that has passed between the Court
relating to these Disputes, we can make no thorough Enquiry.'
The next who spoke on the same Side was Lord Polwarth:
Lord Polwarth.
Sir,
'My honourable Friend has so fully opened the Reasonableness of the present Motion, and so clearly answered the
Right honourable Gentleman over the Way, that I am persuaded I need to say very little.
'It is very true, Sir, as the Right honourable Gentleman
seems to insinuate, that we cannot guess from the Papers now
called for, how the other Powers of Europe stand affected
towards us, or what Assistance either we or the Spaniards
might expect from any of them, in Case of an open Rupture
between the two Nations. But as the Disputes between
Spain and us, have been depending for above these 20
Years; as the Obstinacy of the Court of Spain has been
very great, and as the Interests which we have depending
upon a satisfactory Accommodations of these Differences are very
great; we cannot but suppose, from the known Wisdom and
Foresight of his Majesty's Ministers, that Care has been
taken, by proper Treaties and Alliances, and by the many
Negotiations we have lately carried on, to provide and secure to us all the Assistance we may stand in need of, or at
least to prevent any other Power in Europe from endeavouring to support our Enemies, in any unjust Measures they
may have been guilty of towards us. But suppose it were
otherwise, which I am sure no Gentleman will willingly
suppose; are our Merchants to be plundered, and our Seamen cruelly used, for many Years together in the Time of
profound Peace? Are they to come frequently to Parliament
with Complaints of such Treatment? And is a British Parliament always to content itself with presenting an humble Address to the Throne, praying that his Majesty would use his
Endeavours, for obtaining Satisfaction to his injured Subjects?
'Sir, This would be inconsistent with the Honour and
the Duty of Parliament. In the Case of a domestick
Grievance, if the Parliament should address to have it removed, and if, several Years after, a Petition should be
brought to Parliament, representing that notwithstanding
their Address, the Grievance remained, and was more
heavy and frequent than before; what then would be
the Business and Duty of Parliament? Would not they be
in Honour obliged to enquire, how it came that the
Grievance was not removed, to enquire at whose
Door the Fault lay, and to punish those who had been
guilty? With Respect to any foreign Grievance, our Duty
is the same. The Grievances, the Injuries now complained
of, and so often before complained of, are such as no Nation
ought patiently to suffer, if there be any Way of redressing
them, either by fair or foul Means; and if there be no
Way of redressing them, if by any Misconduct the Nation be
brought into such a melancholy State, that we must suffer
them, which God forbid! the Parliament ought to enquire
into the Affair, if not to find a Remedy, at least to punish
those who have made our Case remediless. Therefore I
must think it incumbent upon us, to proceed now a little
further. We have twice already addressed for having this
Grievance removed: It is now high Time for us to
enquire, how it comes that it has not been removed:
But if we should be so good-natured as to rest satisfied
with presenting a third humble Address, surely that Address ought to be in different Terms from any of the
former. I shall not pretend to tell what we ought to do, or
in what Terms we ought to address, nor can any Gentleman
pretend to tell, till he has seen and deliberately examined
every Paper relating to this Affair.
'The honourable Gentleman over the Way seemed to be
in a mighty Panick, as if we could not agree to this Motion without breaking with Spain. For my Part, Sir, I
have very few Apprehensions of that Kind: Not that I
should wish, that we were to plunge ourselves inconsiderately
into a War with Spain: But, I believe, the Court of Spain
knows too well the Way to prevent Things coming to an
open Rupture. They at the same Time know what the
Consequence of going to War with us at present might
probably be. Therefore, Sir, tho' we were to see these
Papers, and to come to some vigorous Resolutions, I am
afraid they might, by a few fine glossing Overtures, bring us
to treat again, and then we should be just where we are now.
But, Sir, let us suppose that we should go to War; yet I
do not foresee any bad Consequences for the Nation, for
a just and casual War never produces a settled Enmity
between two Nations: Nothing but a perpetual Clashing of
national Interests, can produce such a one; and even tho'
a War should produce such an Enmity, it will always be
more for the Interest, as well as Honour, of this Nation,
that the People of Spain should hate and fear us, than that
they and every other Nation in the World should contemn
and despise us.
'I should be extremely sorry, Sir, to think that all those
who complain of our long Sufferings, with Respect to the
Depredations committed by the Spaniards, are such as are
disaffected to his Majesty and his Family: It would be a
melancholy and a dreadful Prospect, to every Man who has a
true Regard for our present happy Establishment; but I am
sure they are not. I know many of them, who would
venture their Lives and Fortunes for the Support of our
present Establishment, with as much Alacrity as they would
venture them in revenging the Insults, that have been lately
put upon us by the Spaniards. Most of those who complain
are fully sensible, and most will readily acknowledge, that
his Majesty can be no way to blame in this Affair. They
know how ready he is, upon every Oceasion, to vindicate
the Honour of his Crown, or assert the just Rights of his
Subjects; but I doubt much if any of these People will
make the same Acknowledgments with respect to all his
Majesty's Ministers. Who are to blame, or what way
they are to blame, those who complain do not know, nor
can I tell them, till I see the Papers now called for; but
considering the Power of this Nation, when compared with
that of Spain, and considering the many Opportunities we
have lately had, for obtaining or compelling from Spain
a full Satisfaction and Security, every Man concludes, that
some Persons amongst ourselves must be to blame, for our
having so long and so patiently submitted to such Indignities.
If the honourable Gentleman has a Mind to remove all
Cause of Suspicion from himself, the best Thing he can do
is, not to oppose any Thing that may tend to the clearing up
of this Affair; and therefore, I think, if he has any Regard for the Opinion his Countrymen may entertain of him,
he ought to withdraw the Amendment he has been pleased to
offer, and join with us in calling for the late Answer from
Spain, as well as every other Memorial or Answer they have
sent us upon the same Subject.
'What may be in the Papers relating to this Affair,
which are now upon our Table, or what Justification any
Gentleman in the Administration may expect from any of
them, I do not know; for, I neither have been at the Pains
to examine them strictly, nor shall be at any such Pains, till
the Whole be laid before us; and, I hope, the honourable
Gentleman will not think, that this Neglect or Indolence in
me, proceeds from any Unwillingness to vindicate him or any
other Gentlemen concerned in these Transactions; but really
from an Opinion, that I cannot make myself Master of the
Affair, or pass any Judgment relating to it, till the Whole
be laid before the House; and, when that is done, I can assure him, I shall be extremely glad, tho' I must say, I shall
be a little surprized; to find, that we have been guilty of no
Mistake or Blunder, in this long, tedious, and perplexed
Negociation. If this should be the Case, it must be allowed,
that, if we have not, within these twenty Years, added much
to our Character of Fighting, for which we were always famous, we have acquired a new Character, for which we
were never famous, I mean, that of being cunning Negociators, and cautious Treaty makers; this at least is some Comfort to the Nation; and if our long Negociations with the
Court of Spain have been carried on with the Firmness, the
Resolution, and the Prudence, which so delicate, so material,
an Affair required, I shall then congratulate the honourable
Gentleman upon the new Honour the Nation has acquired by
his Means, or by the Means of some of his Friends. However,
Sir, I cannot help thinking it somewhat suspicious, that
none of the right honourable Gentleman's Friends have attempted to vindicate his and their own Conduct from the Papers lying upon our Table, since they seem to think it would
be very easy to do it. This I think would be of very great
Service to him; and I am sure it cannot be said, he wants
Friends, who have Hearts to undertake, and Heads to execute such a Design, in the most elegant, the most polite, and
the most convincing Manner.
'Upon the Whole, Sir, there is nothing can contribute
more to the Good of the Nation, nothing can so effectually prevent our being obliged to come to an open Rupture, as our shewing that we are unanimous, and peremptorily resolved to be at the Bottom of our present Disputes
with Spain, and to put an immediate End to them, either by
the Pens of our Ministers, or the Mouths of our Cannon.
If we begin, in the very first Step, with mincing the Matter,
and seeming to be afraid, lest we should disoblige the Court
of Spain, by any Resolution we may come to, no Man either abroad or at home will believe we are serious, nor will
the Court of Spain think of making any new Offers, or giving plain and explicit Answers. Therefore, if there were
no Necessity for our seeing the last Answer from Spain; I
should be for calling for it, for this Reason only, because it
has been moved for.
'The calling for the last Answer from Spain, Sir, or any
other Paper relating to the Affair we have agreed to enquire
into, is not against any Rule observed in our Proceedings; it
can be attended with no present Danger, nor can it be a
Precedent of dangerous Consequence in Time to come; because, all those Papers, and the last Answer in particular, are
absolutely necessary for the Enquiry we have resolved to make.
If Gentlemen indeed will say, that an Inquiry is improper
and needless, with all my Heart, let them put it on that
Footing; but it would be ridiculous for us to think of enquiring without seeing every Paper that has been sent from
the Court of Spain.
'What Interest, Sir, or what private End, the honourable
Gentleman, or any of his Friends, may have, or if they
have any, for concealing any Memorial or Answer from
Spain, I shall not take upon me to determine; but, I have
already shewn, that he and his Friends are not absolutely unconcerned, even as to the Papers that have been penned or
advised by the Court of Spain; because the Measures of every Court are always influenced by the Measures of others,
especially those with whom they negotiate: Therefore, his
present Opposition may afford some Suspicion of his being
afraid, lest the laying of those Papers before the House
should occasion an Enquiry into his Conduct, or into the
Conduct of some of his Friends; but, I am far from conceiving any such Suspicion; I hope his Conduct and Behaviour has in this Respect, as well as every other, been so wise
and upright, that he fears no impartial Enquiry into his own
Conduct; and, I cannot allow myself to think, he would
desire to prevent an Enquiry into the Conduct of any of his
Friends; because, if they have behaved in the same Manner
he has done, an impartial Enquiry into their Conduct would
redound to their Honour; and, if any of them have behaved
otherwise, I am sure he would scorn to think of endeavouring
to skreen the Guilty.
'Having said thus much, Sir, I shall conclude with my
carnest Wishes, that the House would agree with my honourable Friend's Motion; indeed I think it will be for the Honour of Parliament, and, I hope, the honourable Gentleman has no private End to serve by opposing the calling for,
or even publishing any one of them: Therefore, for the Sake
of Unanimity, and for the Sake of persuading the World
that we are serious in what we are about, I must hope, he
will withdraw the Amendment he has been pleased to offer,
and agree to the Motion as it was at first proposed.'
The next that spoke was Horace Walpole, Esq; whose
Speech was in Substance as follows, viz.
Horace Walpole, Esq;
Sir,
'Tho' it would be very reasonable to put off the Consideration of so important an Affair, and so unexpectedly
brought before the House, as the present Motion has been,
to another Day; yet, as the right honourable Gentleman,
who is principally concerned in the Fate of this Question,
has made no Motion for that Effect, neither shall I, but proceed to consider what has been advanced by the honourable
Gentleman who spoke last against the Amendment. I must
say, I am glad to hear the honourable Gentleman who
spoke last, acting so much the Part of a Friend towards the
honourable Gentleman that spoke before him, as to offer
him his sincere Advice. Whatever Advice the honourable
Gentleman may be pleased to offer, either upon this or any
other Occasion, will always, I am convinced, be gratefully
received, and will be of great Weight with my honourable
Friend near me; but, in the present Case, I doubt much if
his Advice will be taken; I do not, indeed, think it ought.
I shall readily grant that in all Cases a Man ought to consult,
and have a Regard to his own Safety, and that he ought to
chuse that Method of speaking and acting, which will least
expose him to Danger; but, in all Matters of a publick
Concern, I hope it will be allowed, there is a superior Consideration: The Safety of a Man's Country is what he ought
to prefer even to his own Safety; and every Gentleman in
this House, especially those Gentlemen who pique themselves upon their Patriotism, will certainly do so upon all Occasions.
'Considering the Uncertainties of War, as well as the
Uncertainty of all Events which depend upon foreign Negociations; and, considering how much the Judgment of the
inferior Sort, and the Resolutions or Behaviour even of the
better Sort, depend upon the Event of Things; I do not
know, Sir, but that, if my honourable Friend near me
consulted only his own Safety, he would take the Advice that
has been given him: He would chuse to have our future
Conduct proceed from the Resolutions of Parliament, and
would for that End advise laying every Paper relating to the
Affair now under our Consideration before Parliament: But
if he really thinks, the laying of all those Papers before
Parliament, would tend to the Prejudice of his Country, he
ought to oppose it, whatever may be the Event of that Opposition with respect to himself; and if, in such a Case, for
the Sake of his Country, he runs the Risk of drawing upon
himself the Resentment of his Country, it must be allowed,
he acts the Part of a true Patriot.
'I know, Sir, the Part which the honourable Gentleman upon the Floor has acted all along in the Difference
betwixt Spain and us, to be such as gives him no Room to
fear any Discovery to his Disadvantage, from the Papers
that have been moved to be laid before us. Therefore, Sir,
the right honourable Gentleman's Opposition to this Motion,
must proceed from other Motives than personal Fear. I am
convinced, Sir, that he is persuaded, that if the least Answer from Spain were laid before us, it would produce Consequences inconsistent with the Peace of Britain: And I own,
Sir, that I myself am of the same Opinion; I am of Opinion
Sir, that our calling for these Papers is absolutely against the
usual Forms of our Proceeding; for I believe there is no
Precedent of this House having called for any Paper that relates to a Negociation, while the Event of that Negociation
was in Suspence. Therefore, Sir, by our calling for all the
Papers relating to this Negociation, we shall in Effect tell
the World, that we are of Opinion, that his Majesty's Endeavours to procure an honourable and safe Peace, are disagreeable to the Nation, and contrary to the Sense of Parliament. For, I believe no Nation would publish such Papers
with any other View, than that of breaking off all future
Conferences upon that Subject; and the State with whom
they had been in Negociation, would certainly look upon it
as done with that Design, and would therefore resolve not to
treat with them any longer in a friendly and peaceable Manner: Therefore, if it be more for the Good of the Nation to
have this Affair accommodated in a private and peaceable
Manner, than to have recourse to an open and warlike Method, it must be inconsistent with the publick Good to have
all the Papers now called for laid before the House.
'Sir, the publishing of all the Answers from Spain, relating to the Affair now before us, would not only be looked
upon by them, as done with a Design to break off all future
Conferences upon that Subject; but, I believe, it would be
looked upon by them as, and would really I think be, a Sort
of Declaration of War. The publishing of those Papers,
would, in my Opinion, be the same with publishing a Manifesto; for if War were to be declared, and a Manifesto to
be published, that Manifesto must be drawn up chiefly from
those very Memorials or Answers which are now called for;
and I can see no great Difference between publishing a Manifesto, and publishing the Grounds and Reasons upon which
it must be founded, if ever it be published. The Design of
such a Manifesto, if any such Thing were to be published,
would be, to represent in the strongest Light the Insults and
Injuries put upon us by the Spaniards, and the Injustice and
Frivolousness of the Pretences they made use of, for behaving in such a Manner towards us, or for delaying to give
Satisfaction; and this can be done only from the Papers now
called for. As for the Insults and Injuries we have suffered,
they are already too publick: They have been published, and,
I believe, even aggravated, with great Care and Industry;
and therefore, those Papers that give an Account of them,
may be laid before us without any Danger. But as to the
Pretences made use of by Spain, either for justifying those
Insults and Injuries, or for delaying to give a full Reparation
and Satisfaction, they are not yet publickly known, nor
ought they to be made publick, as long as there are any Hopes
of getting the Spaniards, by peaceable Means, to pass from
the Pretences they now make use of, and to make Satisfaction for past Injuries, as well as to give a proper Security against any such in Time to come. When we can no longer
entertain any such Hopes, it will then be Time to publish
and expose the Frivolousness of the Pretences they make use
of; but this ought to be done only by Way of Manifefto
from his Majesty, in order to justify the Force he then finds
himself obliged to make use of; and I am sure no Manifesto, nor any thing like a Manifefto, ought to published,
till we are prepared to back it with such a formidable Armament, as may be suitable to the Power of this Nation, or
necessary for compelling our Enemies to submit to reasonable
Terms; otherwise, Sir, we shall appear not only weak, but
ridiculous.
'It is very easy, Sir, to talk big, either within Doors
or without; and, considering the Spirit of Resentment that
has been industriously stirred up in the Nation, I know, it
would be mighty popular in us, to come to vigorous Resolutions immediately; but I do not know, if it would be
mighty wife. I am sure, it would not be wife, as long as
there are any Hopes of obtaining Redress by peaceable Means;
and even when we are come to an End of all our Hopes in
this Way, we ought not to begin to talk, till we are ready
to act. In this we ought to follow the Example of that Sort
of Animal which is peculiar to this Island; and therefore I
am not ashamed to recommend its Example to my Countrymen: I mean, our brave English Bull Dog, who always
seizes upon his Enemy at once, and without making the least
Noise before hand. Threatening Speeches, or even threatning Resolutions, are but Words. They are Vox & præterea nibil; and therefore the less they are made use of, the
better: But if any such are ever made use of, they ought to
be instantly followed with suitable Actions; for if they are
not, those who have injnred us, will despise our Menaces,
and the whole World will laugh at our Folly.
'When one Nation, Sir, has been insulted or ill-used by
another, and no Redress can be obtained by fair Means, it is
without Doubt extremely proper, and even necessary, for those
who are concerned in the Government of the injured Nation,
to publish and set the Injuries they have suffered in the strongest
Light. This Method has been always thought adviseable,
as it gives the Subject a good Opinion of the Cause, and
makes him contribute with Pleasure towards carrying on the
War; but this ought not to be done till the Court is both resolved and ready to come to an open Rupture. Now, as
those who are concerned in the Government of a Nation are
the best, if not the sole Judges, not only of the Time when
they ought to resolve, but likewise of the Time when they
are ready and prepared to come to an open Rupture; therefore, in my Opinion, they are the only Persons that ought
to be allowed to endeavour to stir up what is called a national
Resentment. For this Reason, I cannot but think, that
some of those Gentlemen who have been lately so busy in
stirring up the Resentment of our People against the whole
Spanish Nation, have gone a little beyond their Sphere:
They have been acting a Part they were no Way qualified
for, either by their Knowledge of publick Affairs, or the
Station they happened to be in. They have been doing all
that they could to involve the Nation in a War, when, for
what they knew, we were in a fair Way of obtaining Redress by peaceable Measures; or perhaps, when our Circumstances, neither at home nor abroad, could allow us to
come to an open Rupture. In either of which Cases it must
be allowed, they have been doing their Country an Injury;
for, with respect to the former, if we should have obtained,
or should yet obtain Redress by peaceable Measures, they
have been doing an Injury to their Country, by endeavouring
to stir up and establish among our People, an Enmity to a
Nation, with which an honourable Member, who has spoke
in this Debate, has owned it is our Interest to be in perpetual Friendship; and even those who should at last be obliged
to come to an open Rupture, yet they have done an Injury
to their Country, by beginning too early to stir up the Resentment of our People; because, when the Resentment of
a People is too soon stirred up, it is apt to evaporate before
it produces the proper Effect.
'Thus, Sir, it must appear, that those busy Intermedlers in publick Affairs have been doing an Injury to their
Country, whatever may be the Effect of our present Negociations; and supposing we were in Circumstances proper for
encouraging us to declare War: But, if we were not in such
Circumstances, they were endeavouring to do a most notable
Injury to their Country; for surely, no greater Injury can
be done to a Country than that of involving it in a War,
when it has no Prospect of being able to prosecute the War
with Advantage. It was a Maxim with Julius Cæsar, never
to venture even a Battle, if the Disadvantages that might
ensue from a Defeat appeared to be greater than any Advantages he could expect from a Victory; and in Africa, we
are told, that he bore with many Insults and Indignities from
the adverse Army, only because by a little Patience he had
Reason to expect being able to obtain a Victory with less
Blood-shed. In resolving upon War or Peace, the same
Maxim ought to be observed; which makes the Question of
such an intricate Nature, that none but those who are
thoroughly acquainted with the Circumstances of a Nation,
can, or ought to deliberate upon it: Therefore as we cannot
pretend to be thoroughly acquainted with the present Circumstances of the Nation, we ought not to do any thing, nor
desire any thing to be done, that may tend towards involving
the Nation in a War; and till his Majesty acquaints us that
he is resolved upon, and prepared for an open Rupture, we
ought not to call for any Paper, that may, for what we
know, tend to confirm, and even irritate that national Resentment, which has been already most imprudently, if not
seditiously, stirred up.
'From what I have said, Sir, I think it is evident, that
the Memorials or Answers from Spain, especially the last,
are in all Probability Papers of such a Nature, that they
cannot yet be communicated to this House. So far indeed I
agree with the honourable Gentleman, that the House is not
obliged to take my Word, nor that of any other Member, as to the Contents of those Papers; but it has always
been observed as a Rule in this House, to call for no Papers,
but such as we had Reason to believe, the Crown might
safely communicate to us. Surely we are not to court a Denial
from the Crown; and upon the present Occasion, we ought
to be more cautious in this Respect than at any other Time.
Every one knows how loth his Majesty is to deny any Thing
to his Parliament. Nothing but the publick Good will ever
prevail with him to do so; and even in such a Case, it would
be with the utmost Reluctance and Uneasiness. I am persuaded every Gentleman that hears me, has such a dutiful Respect for his Majesty, that he would not propose or agree to any thing, that might unnecessarily give him a Moment's Disquiet; but in the present Case, a Denial from the
Crown might be attended with Consequences still more fatal.
It would make all other Foreigners, as well as the Spaniards,
who do not well understand our Constitution, imagine, that
there was no good Harmony between his Majesty and his
Parliament; which would of Course render the Spaniards
less pliable than they are at present, and consequently might
not only prevent our being able to obtain Redress in a peaceable Manner, but might even prevent our being able to form
proper Alliances for obtaining it by Force of Arms.
'It has been said, Sir, that all the Papers now called for,
are absolutely necessary for the Enquiry we have already
resolved on. This, in my Opinion, is very far from being
the Case. We have resolved to take the Petitions now presented to us into our Consideration. In pursuance of this
Resolution, we cannot regularly enter into any Enquiry, but
that which relates to the Truth of the Facts set forth in the
Petitions; and surely we can expect no Proof of those Facts,
from any of the Spanish Memorials. When we have examined into those Facts, and found some or most of them to
be true, which, I believe, will be the Case, such a Discovery
may give a Foundation for our resolving upon another Enquiry; and upon that future Enquiry, it may be thought
necessary for us to see the Memorials or Answers from
Spain. If this should be the Case, they may then be called
for; but till then, I cannot find we have the least Occasion to
examine into any one of them.
'As for an Enquiry into the Conduct of those who have been
concerned in our late Negociations with Spain, Gentlemen may
enter into it when they please; but I hope they would not,
for the Sake of punishing our Negociators, supposing they
have been guilty of Mistakes, resolve to punish the Nation,
by involving it in a dangerous and expensive War, which
in all probability might have been otherwise avoided. I
have had some Hand, Sir, in several Negociations; but, I
think it cannot be said, I had ever any Share in any of our
Negociations with Spain: However, I know something of
them, and from what I know, from what is publickly
known, I must observe, that some Gentlemen seem to be in
a surprising Mistake as to these Negociations. They seem to
insinuate, as if we had been negociating with Spain for above
twenty Years without any Effect. Surely, Gentlemen cannot
have forgot, that, within these twenty Years, there have been two
publick and famous Treaties between Spain and us; by each of
which they promised full Reparation for all past Injuries,
and that no such Injuries should be committed for the future.
We all know, that in the Year 1721 a Treaty of Peace was
concluded at Madrid between Spain and us, which was the
same Year confirmed by the Treaty of Alliance between
Great Britain, France, and Spain; that by the second Article of the said Treaty, 'all former Treaties were confirmed; and that by the third Article, his Catholick Majesty
expresly promised, 'that all the Goods, Merchandizes, Money, Ships, and other Effects, which had been seized, as
well in Spain as the Indies, should be speedily restored in
the same Kind, or according to the just and true Value of
them, at the Time they were seized.
'I am not, Sir, to answer for every Stop that brought on
that Treaty; some Gentlemen, perhaps, know more of them
than I do, but I will venture to say, Sir, that we must from
hence suppose, that by this Treaty an End was put to all
Negociations before that Time; and that from this Treaty
our Ministers had Reason to expect full Reparation for all
past Injuries, and a Security against all such in Time to
come; but some new Differences having afterwards arisen
between the two Nations, a new Treaty was set on Foot,
which was afterwards concluded at Seville, in the Year 1729.
By this new Treaty a Reparation for past Injuries, and a
Security against future, were again expresly stipulated; for,
by the first Article, 'all former Treaties of Peace, Friendship,
and Commerce, are renewed and confirmed;' and they expresly promise, 'not to do any Thing, nor suffer any Thing
to be done, that may be contrary thereto, directly or indirectly.' By the fourth Article, it is stipulated, 'particularly, that the Commerce of the English Nation in America should be exercised as heretofore; and that Orders
should be dispatched, without any Delay, as well for the
Execution of the said Treaties of Commerce, as for supplying
what may be wanting for the entire Re-establishment of
Commerce, on the Foot of the said Treaties and Conventions.' And by the sixth Article it is agreed, 'that Commissaries should be nominated within four Months after the
Exchange of the Ratifications, for examining and deciding
the respective Pretensions which related to the Abuses supposed to have been committed in Commerce, as well in the
Indies as in Europe, and all the other respective Pretensions
in America, whether with respect to the Limits, or otherwise;' and they promise, 'to cause to be executed punctually and exactly, what should be so decided by the said
Commissaries, within six Months after their making their
Report;' which Report they were, by the eighth Article,
to make within three Years, to be computed from the Day
of the Signing of that Treaty.
'Accordingly, we know, Sir, that, Commissaries were
respectively nominated; but by various Accidents the Meeting of these Commissaries was delayed till the Beginning of
the Year 1732; and therfeore the Time for their finishing
their Commission, and making their Report, was prolonged to
the End of three Years after their first Meeting; so that the
Negociations, upon the Footing on which they are at present,
cannot be said to have commenced till the Beginning of the
Year 1735, and therefore cannot be said to have lasted above
three Years; and from considering these Treaties, especially
the last, and the several Steps that have been made by us
since that Time, it must be granted, I think, that we have
done all that a prudent and wise People could do for obtaining, in a peaceable Manner, a full Reparation for all past
Injuries, and an absolute Security against our being exposed
to any such in Time to come. If there is any Fault therefore, it must be wholly attributed to the Spaniards, who have
refused or neglected to perform the repeated solemn Engagements they have entered into with us; but with regard to
their Behaviour towards us, or whether the Breaches of Promise they have been guilty of can warrant an immediate
Rupture, is an Enquiry which cannot, come regularly before
this House; nor ought we, by our Constitution, to attempt
any such Enquiry: It is an Enquiry which ought to be left
entirely to his Majesty's Wisdom and Justice; because, from
thence it is that Peace or War must be determined; and, I
hope, it will be admitted, that our pretending to determine in
this Case, would be an Incroachment upon the Prerogatives
of the Crown.
'The Parliament, 'tis true, Sir, is the great and the supreme Council of the Nation, and consequently it is the
Council in which our King ought to put his chief Confidence, and which he ought to consult upon all important
Affairs, when those Affairs are brought to such Maturity, or
to such a Crisis, as to be ripe for being made publick; but,
no Man will pretend, that the Parliament is a secret Council,
or, that any Affair ought to be laid before Parliament, till it
can be safely communicated to the Publick. Negociations of
all Kinds are of such a Nature, that while they continue in
the Shape of Negociations, they ought to be kept inviolably
secret; and, it is for this Reason that, by the Excellence
and Wisdom of our Constitution, the Power of making Peace
or War is lodged solely in the Crown; because, for the Good
of the Nation, it is absolutely necessary, that all the Steps
we make towards a Peace, should be kept secret, till a Treaty is actually concluded for that Purpose; and likewise it is
necessary, that all the Steps we make towards a War, nay,
even our Preparations for War, should be kept as secret as
possible, till a War is actually declared, or at least just ready
to be declared. In the present Case, if our Negociations
with Spain should end in a Treaty, which I hope they will,
and I dare say every Gentleman here wishes his Country so
well as to hope the same, his Majesty will then, without
doubt, communicate that Treaty to his Parliament; and, on
the other Hand, if our present Negociations should prove abortive, if his Majesty should at last find, that nothing will
prevail but the Ultima Ratio Regum, he will certainly make
such Alliances, and take such Measures, as he in his great
Wisdom may think proper or necessary, for rendering the
Issue of that War advantageous and glorious to this Nation;
and when he has not only fully resolved upon War, but is
fully prepared for coming to an open Rupture, he will
then communicate to his Parliament the several Steps
he has taken, and all the Papers that may be necessary for
giving them a sufficient Light into the Affair. This, I say,
Sir, we may be assured of, from his Majesty's known Wisdom, and from the Condescension he has always shewn towards his Parliaments; therefore, we ought to be extremely
cautious in calling for any Papers, that may tend towards
rendering publick any present Negociation his Majesty may
beengaged in; and as this would probably be the Consequence
of laying any of the late Memorials or Answers from Spain
before us, we ought to suspend our Curiosity, till his Majesty may think it proper to communicate them.
'I hope, Sir, I have now clearly shewn, that none of the
Memorials or Answers from Spain can be said to be necessary for any Enquiry we have as yet resolved on; and that
the communicating of any of them to this House, or even
our calling for them, would be of dangerous Consequence.
Then, as to the Unanimity of our Proceedings, I cannot but
think it is as strong an Argument for prevailing with the
honourable Gentleman who made the Motion, to agree to
the Amendment proposed, as it can be for prevailing with
my hononourable Friend to withdraw the Amendment he has
offered; therefore, whatever. Regard he may have for the
honourable Gentleman who was so good as to offer him Advice, I hope he. will, upon the present Occasion, take the
Liberty to refuse it; and, I hope that, for the Sake of Unanimity, the honourable Gentleman who made the Motion,
will be the first to agree to the Amendment that has been
offered.'
Sir William Windham spoke next:
Sir Wm. Windham.
Sir,
'When the honourable Gentleman who proposed the Amendment, first gave his Reasons against some Part of the
Motion that has been made to us, I was pretty much inclined
to agree with, him in Opinion; but since I have more fully
considered the Circumstances of the Case before us,
and have heard what has been said on the other. Side of
the Question, I must be for agreeing to the Motion
without any Amendment; therefore I hope the honourable Gentleman will take the Advice that has been
offered him, and give up his Amendment, notwithstanding
what has been said to the contrary by his worthy Friend near
him; for, I think, no Man can more effectually shew his
difinterested Regard for the Good of his Country, than by
contributing as much as he can towards shewing to the World,
that we are not only serious but unanimous upon the present
Occasion.
'If Peace, Sir, be a desirable Thing, there is, in my Opinion, nothing that will contribute more towards our being
able to procure a proper Redress, in a peacable Manner,
than our agreeing unanimously to the Motion now made to
us. I make no Question but that an Express will this very
Night be sent to the Court of Spain; and I hope that Express will carry the News not only of our having agreed to
this Motion, but of our having unanimously agreed to it.
This, I say, I hope, nay I most heartily wish it may be
so; because I am convinced, that nothing can contribute more
towards preventing our being obliged to come to Extremities;
for I am sure no Man will say but that we ought to come to
Extremities, rather than continue any longer to sit
tamely under the Insults and Indignities that have been
put upon the Nation, in the Persons of some of our
most useful Subjects; and the best Way of obtaining Reparation and Security by fair Means, is to shew that we are resolved to have it by foul, if it cannot be otherwise obtained.
If by our Behaviour upon the present Occasion, it should be
made apparent to the World, and particularly to the Court of
Spain, that this is our Resolution, it may probably render
that Court a little more pliable than our Negotiators have
ever yet found them; for in publick as well as private Life,
the surest Way of living in Peace and Quiet, is to gain and
preserve the Character of being ready, upon any just Provocation, to try the Fate of a Combat.
'I cannot comprehend, Sir, why it has been so much infisted on in this Debate, that it is the Interest of this Nation
to keep up a good Correspendence with Spain: I am sure
it is as much the Interest of Spain to keep up a good Correspondence with us, as it is our Interest to live in Friendship
with them; and former Experience has often shewn, that
they have more Reason to be afraid of a Rupture with us,
than we have to be afraid of a Rupture with them. They have,
'tis true, of late Years, set up some Pretences which are inconsistent with Justice and the Rights of this Nation: They
have plundered our Merchants, and maletreated our Seamen;
and they have refused, or unreasonably delayed, to give us
any proper Satisfaction. What can this be owing to? It is
not owing to their being ignorant of their own Interest, or of
the Danger they may expose themselves to by coming to an
open Rupture with us. It must be owing to some unaccountable Notion they have begun to entertain, that we are afraid
of coming to an open Rupture with them; and while they
entertain such a Notion, they will never do us Justice in a
peaceable Manner. How they came at first to conceive such
a Notion I do not know; but I must say, that by our late
Patience and Forbearance, not only they, but all the World,
I believe, begin to think that we will submit to any Thing
rather than engage in a War; and while this Opinion prevails, we may live in Peace, but I am sure we cannot live
at Ease, or in Quiet. It is therefore high Time to resume
the antient, and what, I hope, will always be found to
be the true Character of this Nation. It is high Time,
it is even become necessary for us to do something
for convincing the World that we are now, and always
will be, ready to vindicate our Honour by Force of Arms,
when we cannot obtain a full Satisfaction by peaceable Means;
and upon the present Occasion we can do this, only by agreeing unanimously upon the most vigorous Resolutions,
upon such Resolutions, as ought to be the immediate Consequence of the Treatment our Merchants and Sailors have
met with. This is what has already been too long delayed;
and it is what cannot now be regularly done without our
having first seen, or at least called for, those very Papers
which, by the Amendment, are proposed to be left out of
the Motion.
'From what I have said, Sir, it will appear, that the
chief, I may say the only Argument made use of against
our calling for the Answers or Memorials from Spain, is
really one of the strongest Arguments for it. The chief
Argument made Use of against our calling for these Papers
is founded on a Supposition, that the laying of such Papers
before us may interrupt the Course of our peaceful Negotiations, and involve the Nation in a War. Now will not
our refusing, or even delaying, for such a Reason, to call
for Papers, which are certainly extremely proper to be
look'd into, upon the present Occasion, be a Testimony of
our being terribly afraid of involving the Nation in a
War? Will it not confirm the Notion, which I am
afraid the Spaniards now entertain of us? Will it not
make them conclude that we are more afraid of coming
to an open Rupture with them, than we are fond of
doing Justice to our injured Merchants? And as an Account
of this Day's Debate will certainly be sent to the Court of
Spain, will not they presume from thence, that they may
still put off agreeing to any reasonable Terms, or offering
any proper Satisfaction? This will of Course make it necessary for us to come to Extremities; so that like those private
Men, who have the Misfortune to have a sheepish Look, or
too much Medesty in their Behaviour, we may probably
draw ourselves into a Quarrel, which a little decent Boldness
might have prevented. From whence it is plain, that our
agreeing to the Amendment the honourable Gentleman has
been pleased to offer, will most probably lead the Nation into what he seems to be most afraid of; unless he thinks,
which I am sure is far from being the Case, that we ought
to bear patiently with all past Injuries, and submit tamely
to all future, rather than run the Risk of a War.
'I shall grant, Sir, that no Negotiation, nor any material Paper relating to it, ought to be made publick, till that
Negotiation be brought to a Period; but where neither Party
has a Mind to amuse and deceive the other, every Negociation
must soon be brought to a Period. The Protracting of
any Negotiation, for a Number of Years, is a certain Sign,
that one of the Parties at least has a Mind to amuse and deceive, as might be proved by a vast Number of Examples;
but one I cannot forbear mentioning upon this Occasion, because it is an Example drawn from an Affair that happened
between us and the very Kingdom with which we are now
said to be, and with which we have long been carrying on,
what I am afraid will at last appear to be a fruitless Negociation. The Example I mean is that Negociation which we carried on with Spain, in the Reign of James I. about the
Marriage of his Son the Prince of Wales. That Negociation continued for near eight Years; and as we have now
sent Commissaries, so we then sent the Prince of Wales and
the Prime Minister to Spain, without any Effect: But at last
it appeared that the Negociation was carried on with a Design to amuse us, and to keep us quiet, till the House of
Austria found Means to ruin almost entirely the Protestant Interest in Germany; and I do not know but their Design may
now be, to amuse us, and keep us quiet, till our Trade be
entirely ruined; which will be the Case, if we go on with
Negociating, and they with Plundering and Seizing our
Merchant Ships, but for a few Years longer.
'For this Reason, Sir, as the present Negociation has
already continued for so many Years, its not being brought
to a Period, is so far from being a Reason for our not calling
for any Papers relating to it, that it is a good Reason for
our enquiring into the Negociation itself. From the long
Continuance of our present Negociations with Spain, there
is great Reason to suspect they have hitherto been amusing us
only; and from the Circumstances of our present Disputes
with that Nation, this Suspicion must be considerably increased: For as we may be said to be Plaintiffs only, and
they Defendants, which I am sorry for, it is their Interest to
amuse and protract, because upon the Issue they will not
only have a large Sum to pay us, but must give up some
valuable Rights they have lately begun to lay claim to;
whereas we have been of late so just and so complaisant to
them, that we have already left them nothing to ask.
'Now, Sir, if this be the Case, if there is but Ground
to suspect that any of our inferior Councils have allowed
themselves to be amused and deceived, it is high Time for
the supreme and chief Council of the Nation to take the
Negociation itself into their Consideration; and for that
Purpose to call for all Papers relating to it; in order that
we may give his Majesty such Advice as may be thought
proper upon such an Occasion. Such a Resolution can no
way tend to make the Court of Spain break off Conferences
with us: If they have a Mind to do us Justice, rather than
come to an open Rupture, it would make them begin to
treat with us upon a fair, a candid, and a serious Footing,
which, in my Opinion, they have never yet done: But if
they are really resolved to come to an open Rupture, rather
than do us Justice, the Effect of such a Resolution would
then indeed be, not to make them break off Conferences
with us, but to make us break off Conferences with them;
for as they are Defendants only, it is their Business to negotiate, as long as we will negotiate with them; and as we
are Plaintiffs only, it is our Business to insist upon a speedy and
a categorical Answer; and in Case of Refusal or Delay, to
break off all Conferences, and betake ourselves to those Means,
which may probably prove more effectual. Can either of these
be called an Effect which we ought to be afraid of? No, Sir,
even the last, is an Effect which we ought to be fond off;
for if a sufficient Redress is not to be obtained without a Rupture, the sooner we come to it the better: A State of War
is more eligible than the uncertain, mongrel State we are in
at present.
'But we are now told, Sir, that the present Negociations
between Spain and us have not continued for above three Years;
and to prove this, the honourable Gentleman who spoke
last, has been pleased to give us a long Account of the many
Treaties lately concluded between the two Crowns. No
Man, 'tis true, is more able than he to give an Account of our
late Treaties and Negociations; and I shall own my Obligation for the exact Account he has given of some of them;
but, 'tis certain, and even that honourable Gentleman will,
I believe, allow, that the Spaniards have been continuing
their Incroachments and Depredations almost without Interruption for above twenty Years; and he will, I believe,
likewise allow, that as yet we have obtained no Reparation
for past Injuries, nor any Security against future. What is
it then appears from the long Account he has given us of
the late Treaties between Spain and us? Does it not from
thence appear, that we have been for above twenty Years not
only negociating, but actually concluding Treaties, in vain,
and without the least Effect? What Hopes other Gentlemen
may put in our present Negociating I do not know; but
for my Part I must declare, that I put no great Hopes in any
Negociation we can carry on, or any Treaty or Convention
we can make; and I must think I am justified in this Way
of thinking, by the Account the honourable Gentleman has been pleased to give us of the late Treaties
concluded between Spain and us. By these Treaties
they have two or three Times already expressly promised
full Reparation and Security: They have as yet performed
none of these Promises. What Reason have we to think,
they will be more faithful in the Performance of any
Promise they may make by the next Treaty, or by any
future Treaty? I am sure, if they do shew themselves more
faithful in Time to come, it will not proced from our
shewing such a Backwardness in coming to an open Rupture with them, as some Gentlemen seem to shew upon
the present Occasion. No Nation in the World will perform a Promise, tho' made by the most solemn Treaty, if it
be against their Interest to do so: They will always find
Pretences for delaying or evading it, if they think they can
do so with Safety; and they will always think so, if they
have any Reason to believe, that the Nation, in whose Favour it was made, is so impotent or so cowardly, that they
dare not attempt in a hostile Manner to revenge an Infraction
of a solemn Treaty.
This, I am afraid, Sir, is the Case between Spain and us.
We have been of late so passive, that, I fear, they have begun to think we will not, or dare not come to an open Rupture with them; and if this be then Way of Thinking,
there is nothing will alter their Opinion, but a vigorous and
well-conducted War; so that by our Long-suffering and extreme Readiness to oblige them, instead of avoiding a War,
we have already made it become necessary. They may
grant us the Favour of a new Treaty; they may by that
Treaty again promise full Reparation and Security; but if
they continue in the same Way of Thinking, those Promises
will be as ill-kept as any of the former. In my Opinion, it
is therefore absolutely improper for us, upon the present Occasion, to shew the least Concern about what may be the
Consequences of any Resolution proposed. An unanimous
and hearty Concurrence in the most vigorous Resolutions, may
make them alter their Opinion of us, or may make them
think, that we are resolved to alter our Conduct with respect
to them; and this I take to be the only Way of avoiding a
War, which will otherwise, either now or very soon hereafter,
become absolutely unavoidable; unless we are resolved always to submit tamely to the same Sort of Injuries we have
already suffered, and to forfeit our Character and our Trade
in every Part of the World.
'I shall readily admit, Sir, that it would be ridiculous in
us to talk big, or to come to vigorous Resolutions, upon
this or any other Occasion, unless those Resolutions were
to be followed by suitable Actions. Nay, I believe, it would
be ridiculous in us to fit out formidable Squadrons, or to
take great Armies into our Pay, unless those Fleets and
those Armies were to be furnished with proper Orders or Instructions for enabling them to follow Words with Blows, in
Case of any Denial or unreasonable Delay of Justice. I
know that threatening Memorials, are but Words; and, I
believe, the honourable Gentleman talks from Experience,
when he says, that such Words will always be contemned,
if People imagine they are not to be immediately followed
with suitable Actions: But whatever Disrespect may have
been shewn to the threatening Words or Memorials of other
Councils, I hope no Sign of Disregard will ever be shewn
to the threatening Resolutions of a British Parliament. I hope
no Nation will ever imagine, that such Words are not to be
followed with suitable Actions. The Kingdom of Spain, as
well as one of her next Neighbours, has still Reason to remember the Resolutions of our Parliament in the Year
1701-2. From the Behaviour of the Nation at that Time,
and for some Years after, they must conclude, that the threatenning Resolutions of a British Parliament will be followed,
and speedily followed, by suitable Actions, They have
from thence good Reason to conclude, that, even at this
Time, our Words will not only be followed with Blows, but
that every Blow will be followed by another, till we bring
our Enemies to reasonable Terms; and as the Justice of our
Cause is now as great as it was then, I am sure our Enemies
have no Cause to expect greater Favour from Providence,
than they met with at that Time: Therefore, if they have
any Hopes of Success, it must be in our Misconduct, or
in the supposed Weakness of our Councils; and if they
should bring Things to Extremity, I hope they will find
themselves disappointed in both.
'With respect to the general Resentment, that now
prevails over the whole Nation, against the Depredations
committed by the Spaniards, however disagreeable it may be
to some Gentlemen, I must declare, that it is extremely agreeable to me; and it is so, because I think it is just. I do
not really know what the honourable Gentleman means by
saying, that it has been stirred up by those who had no
Title to stir it up, or who did not know what they were about. I believe it has been stirred up by none but the
Spaniards themselves; for I have so good an Opinion of the
Understanding of my Country-Men in general, as to believe, that their Judgment, and consequently their Resentment, as well as their Gratitude, depends upon the Nature
of Things, and not upon what may be said or wrote upon
any Subject. For this Reason, if none of the Actions of
the Spanish Guarda Costa's had been unjust, if their Behaviour towards our Merchants had not been cruel and barbarous as well as unjust, I believe it would have been impossible to have strirred up such a general Resentment as now
prevails against them, tho' all the best Pens in the Nation
had been as much employed to throw their Actions into
a malicious and invidious Light, as some of the worst have
been to palliate and excuse, or rather justify their Behaviour
towards us. I must therefore think, that it signifies very
little who they are that endeavour to stir up the Resentment
of the People; because, if there is a just Cause for it,
their Resentment will rise of Course; and if there is no Cause
for it, no Art or Persuasion will be able to raise it. The
Resentment of the Nation is, 'tis true, come to a very great
Height upon the present Occasion, and if it should evaporate
before it produces the desired Effect, it is easy to foresee who
will deserve to be blamed; but tho' there are no People of
a more generous and forgiving Temper than the People of
this Nation, yet, I hope, they will never allow their Resentment to evaporate: I hope they will neither forget nor
forgive, till they see Justice done to such of their CountryMen as have been injured, and a full Satisfaction made to
the Nation for the Insults that have been put upon it.
'I have now, I hope, shewn, Sir, that if we have a
Mind to take the best Method for preventing a War, or obtaining Redress in a peaceable Manner, we ought to agree
unanimously to the Motion without any Amendment. What
the Answer from the Crown may be, I shall not pretend to
determine, because I know nothing of the Nature of any of
the Papers called for; but surely our Addressing to have them
laid before us can be of no Prejudice. Suppose his Majesty
should think it inconsistent with the publick Safety to lay
some of those Papers before us, his being obliged to tell us so
can give him no Disquiet; because it is a proper Answer, and
an Answer which this House has generally been satisfied with:
It is an Answer which cannot make any Man, that has a Weight
in any foreign Council, nor any Man of common Understanding
at home, suppose that there is the least Disagreement between his Majesty and his Parliament; because we cannot
suppose the Ministers of any foreign Court we have to
do with, nor any Man of Common Sense at home, so ignorant
of our Constitution, as not to know that the Parliament always leaves, it to the Crown to determine, what Papers are
fit to be laid before them; and never insist upon a Sight of
any Paper, after the Crown has told them that it is not safe to
make it publick, unless when they have Reason to suspect,
that such an Answer proceeds from evil Counsel, and from the
selfish Ends of a Minister, in order to conceal some criminal
or false Step he has been guilty of. Then, indeed, the Parliament would probably insist upon having such a Paper laid
before them, and might perhaps address the King to know
who advised him to send such an Answer; and then it might
be supposed, both abroad and at home, that there was no
great Harmony between the King and his Parliament, or
at least between his Ministers and his Parliament; but surely,
neither the honourable Gentleman who spoke last, nor any other, has the least Ground to suspect that this may be the Case at
present; and if it were, it would be the strongest Argument for
agreeing to the Motion, to the end that the Parliament
might have an Opportunity of removing such Ministers
from his Majesty's Councils; for if such Men were at the
Helm of our Affairs, which I am sure is not the Case at
present, we could neither expect Regard or Confidence from
foreign States, nor any Honesty or good Conduct in our own
Affairs, with respect either to Peace or War.
'Thus, I think, it appears, Sir, that our calling for the
Memorials or Answers from Spain can be attended with no
bad Consequence, even supposing them to be such as cannot be safely communicated; and I have shewn, that our not
calling for them may be attended with the most fatal Consequence, by confirming the Court of Spain in the Notion
they seem to entertain of us, that we are afraid, and
will rather submit to any Thing, than come to an open Rupture with them. But we are told, we ought not to call for
them, because we have now no Occasion for them; and to
shew we have no Occasion for them, it is said, that in Pursuance of the Resolution we have come to, we cannot regularly, at first, enter into any Enquiry, but that of the Truth
of the Facts set forth in the Petitions now presented to us.
This I am surprized to hear from a Gentleman so well acquainted with the Facts set sorth in the Petitions, and so much
a Master of the Customs and Methods of Proceeding in Parliament. Sir, we have no Occasion for such an Enquiry
but for Form's sake merely. We all know the Facts are
true; and if we proceed no further, I shall be sorry we have
gone so far; for we shall then only leave upon Record, in
the Journals of Parliament, a Testimony of the Insults and
Injuries we have tamely suffered, which is a Testimony that
can no Way contribute to the Honour of the Nation; and
therefore we ought to be so far from recording, that, if it
were possible, we ought to prevent its being handed down to
Posterity. If we look but into the Prayer of the Petitions
presented to us, we must see we have something else to do,
than merely to enquire into the Truth of Facts. The Petitioners beseech us, 'To provide such a timely and adequate
Remedy, as may put an End to all Insults and Depredations
on the British Subjects; and to procure such Relief for the
unhappy Sufferers, as the Nature of their Case, and the
Justice of their Cause, require.' Are we not then, in Pursuance of our Resolution, to endeavour to provide such a
Remedy, and procure such Relief ? And is it possible for us
to determine what may be a proper Remedy, what may be
a proper Relief, without seeing what the Court of Spain have
offered, and what they pretend in Justification of themselves ?
'There are but two Ways, Sir, of providing a Remedy
or procuring any Relief: It must be done either by Force of
Arms, or by Negociation; and which of these Methods
may be most proper, is what we are to determine; it is what
we have in some Measure already resolved to determine, by
resolving to take the Petitions into our Confideration: For
this Purpose we must necessarily examine into the Whole of
our past Negociations, whether they appear in the Form of
Negociation or of Treaty, as yet neither fulfilled, nor any
Way observed. Which of those Methods may, upon the
Enquiry we have resolved on, appear to be most proper, I
shall not now take upon me to determine; but in this Affair
we have already made use of so much Ink and Paper without
any Effect, that I am afraid it will appear necessary for us to
begin to make use of another Sort of Ammunition. We have
already found there is no Trust to be put even in Treaties, and
therefore, after we have thoroughly examined into this Affair,
it may be the Opinion of this House, that we must now have
Recourse to that, in which we have always found, in which
I hope, we always shall find, our chief and greatest Security,
I mean, Sir, the Weight of our Metal, and the Sharpness
of our Swords.
'Now, suppose, Sir, we should come to such a Resolution; suppose we should upon Enquiry find that no effectual Remedy can be provided, nor any sufficient Relief
procured, but by Force of Arms; that Resolution, to be
sure, is to be offered to his Majesty by Way of Advice. In
so doing we incroach upon none of the Prerogatives of the
Crown: We do that only which is our Duty; for we are
obliged to offer what we think the most wholesome Advice
to our Sovereign. Neither do we communicate to the
Publick the Secrets of any Negociation, while it continues, or ought to continue, in the Shape of a Negociation; we only give our Opinion that it ought
not to be continued in that Shape any longer; and
surely, if the Parliament think so, they have a Right
to say so, and to communicate their Thoughts, by Way of
Address, to his Majesty. The Power of making Peace or
War may be solely lodged in the Crown; but the Parliament
certainly have a Right to advise and address against the Continuance of Peace, when they think it cannot be continued
with Honour, as well as they have a Right to advise and
address against a War, which they think cannot be prosecuted
with Advantage. This is, in my Opinion, the principal
Enquiry we are to make, when we take these Petitions
into our Consideration: We are to enquire, whether there
be any Probability of obtaining what the Petitioners pray for,
in a peaceable Manner; and upon such an Enquiry, I am
sure, we can come to no Determination, without seeing those
Papers that are proposed by the Amendment to be left out
of the Motion: Therefore, I hope, the honourable Gentleman will withdraw his Amendment, and leave it to his Majesty, who is the only proper Judge, to determine, whether
the Papers now moved for, are such as may be safely communicated to the House.'
The next who spoke was the honourable Henry Pelham Esq;
Mr. Pelham.
Sir,
'I must say, I am sorry the honourable Gentleman, who
spoke last, did not continue in his first Opinion; for I am
always fond of having an Opportunity to join with him in
the same Sentiments; but upon the present Occasion I cannot;
because, I think, the honourable Gentleman who proposed
the Amendment, gave such Reasons for what he proposed,
as neither have, nor, in my Opinion, can be answered. I
shall admit, Sir, that it is as necessary for a Nation to preserve its Character among Neighbours, as it is for a private
Man; but whatever Opinion the Court of Spain may entertain of our Courage, or of our Unwillingness to come to
an open Rupture with them, I shall never be for doing any
Thing that may tend towards involving this Nation into an
unnecessary War, for the Sake only of making that Nation
believe we are no Way afraid of them. The Character of
this Nation for Resolution and Courage is already so well established, that we have no Occasion for making use of any
Sort of hectoring Expressions, in order to convince the World,
that we are not afraid of the Spaniards, whom the Gentlemen who are for a War represent as a very feeble Enemy.
Therefore, if upon any false and ill-grounded Opinion of
our Timidity, they should absolutely refuse to do us Justice,
we may easily persuade them, that our Patience proceeded
not from our Fear, but from our Prudence; but this is not to
be done by any Resolutions of this House; it is to be done
only by Fleets and Armies, after his Majesty has told us that
nothing else will prevail. For this Reason, as long as there
is the least Ground to hope, that the Court of Spain may be
prevailed on by peaceable Means to give Ear to Reason, we
ought not to do any thing that may tend to interrupt or retard any Negociation, that may be carrying on for that Purpose: And that we are not as yet intirely destitute of such
Hopes, must be presumed; because, we may be assured,
that as soon as this comes to be our Case, his Majesty will
apply in the most solemn Manner to his Parliament, both
for Advice and Assistance.
'As for the last Answer or Memorial from Spain, I do not
pretend, Sir, to know what it is; but I have been assured
from Authority which I have no Reason to suspect, that
it can no Way be looked on as a final Answer. It is so far
from being a flat Denial of Justice, that it seems to shew an
Inclination towards doing Justice, as soon as some disputed
Facts can be cleared up; and I am told it may admit of
such Explanations, as may put an End to all our Differences
in a peaceable Manner: Nay, I have good Reason, I think,
to suppose it such a-one; for if it had been otherwise, I am
convinced his Majesty would have directly ordered it to have
been laid before the House. Suppose it then such an Answer
as, by proper Explanations, may lay a Foundation for our
obtaining full Satisfaction and Security, in a peaceable
Manner; I should be glad to know how those Explanations
are to be obtained. The only Way of obtaining any such,
must be by a new Memorial from this Court to that of Spain,
by Way of Reply to their last Answer; but if we order
their last Answer to be laid before this House, we shall, in a
great Measure, put it out of his Majesty's Power to send any
such Reply; for in that Case, I believe, none of his Majesty's Servants would venture to advise him to send a Reply,
or to give their Opinion what Sort of Reply ought to be
sent, until the Parliament had thoroughly examined into the
Affair, and had come to such Resolutions as they should
think proper upon the Occasion. This the Parliament may
not be able to do till towards the End of the Session, during
which Time the Negociation between the two Courts must
be at an intire Stand; whereas, if it be left to his Majesty,
to send such a Reply as he may think most proper, the Negociation may before that Time be brought to some Period
or another; and in our present Circumstances, I am sure,
nothing can be of Advantage to this Nation, that will necessarily, but needlesly, occasion a Delay in adjusting our
Differences with the Court of Madrid.
'From hence, Sir, I think it is evident, that our calling
for the last Memorial from Spain would be imprudent; and
whatever Necessity there may be for our seeing the last or
any of the Memorials from that Court, before we can come
to any final Determination, relating to the Petitions we have
resolved to take into our Consideration, yet that Neceffity
neither does, nor can now appear; and therefore, I do not
think there is, as yet, the least Occasion for our calling for
any of these Memorials. In the Course of the Enquiry we are
resolved to make, it may appear necessary for us to have all
those Memorials laid before us, and when that does appear, I
shall be ready to join with other Gentlemen in any proper
Motion for that Purpose; but till then, I think it ought to
be delayed, because our immediately calling for them, especially the last, may be attended with some Inconvenience, and
because such a Delay can but very little, if any Way, retard our Proceedings with respect to the Affair now before us.
By the Resolution you have come to, it will be near a Fortnight before you begin to take this Affair into your Consideration; and as some Things may intervene, that may oblige
you to put off the entering upon it for some Days longer; and
likewise, as you may meet with Interruptions in the Course of
your Enquiry; I must reckon it will be near three Weeks, it
may be more, before you can know positively, whether there
will be any Necessity for your having any of those Memorials
laid before you; therefore you may, I think, without the
least Inconvenience, delay calling for any of them for two or
three Weeks at least. In the mean Time, his Majesty may
have sent to the Court of Spain a Reply to their last Answer,
and then your calling for that Answer can no Way interrupt
the Course of the Negociation, nor can it be attended with
such dangerous Consequences, as your calling for it now may
be attended with: Nay, I do not know but that, if a Reply
be immediately sent, demanding the necessary Explanations,
and insisting upon a categorical Answer, which I am convinced his Majesty will do with all possible Dispatch; I do
not know, I say, but that in this Case, a new Memorial may
arrive from the Court of Spain, before it be necessary for
you to come to any Resolutions relating to this Affair; and
that new Memorial will certainly have a great Influence upon your Resolutions, as well as upon his Majesty's future
Conduct with regard to Spain.
'I shall grant, Sir, that in case of our calling for any
Papers, it is a proper enough Answer from the Crown, to
tell us, they are of such a Nature, that they cannot be safely communicated; but on the other Hand, I believe it will
be allowed, that such an Answer from the Crown is unusual;
and the Reason of its being so, is, because both House of
Parliament have generally taken care to call for no Papers
but such as might, in all Appearance, be safely communicated. Now, though I do not pretend to know what is in
the last Memorial or Answer from Spain, yet from its having
arrived so lately, we may, I think, with Probability, if not
with Certainty, conclude, that it is a Paper which ought not
yet to be made publick; and therefore, however proper
such an Answer from the Crown may be, I must think such
an Application from this House would not be altogether so
proper at present For this Reason, I think, it would be
more agreeable to the Custom of Parliament, and more proper for us, not to call for any of the Memorials from Spain,
but to leave it intirely to his Majesty, to order such of them
to be laid before us, as he shall think may be safely communicated; and this he will certainly do in due Time, if there
be any Thing in any of these Memorials, that may require
the Consideration of Parliament.
'After what I have said, Sir, I hope Gentlemen will excuse me if I say, that I think it would be rash and precipitate
in us, to call for all or any of these Memorials at present; and
though we had them all before us, I must think, it would
be still more rash in us to come to any violent or threatening
Resolutions, unless his Majesty had before told us, that he
had no farther Hopes of obtaining full Satisfaction in a
peaceable Manner; for even in private Life, let a Man be
never so much inclined to do Justice, or to make Reparation, he would not like to be publickly threatened into it:
The Attempting to make use of such a Method, would probably make him stand upon a Panctilio of Honour, and refuse, at least for that Time, to do, what he would have done
with great Alacrity, if it been required of him in a discreet
and prudent Manner.
'It is true, Sir, the Negociations between Spain and us
have already continued too long, and it must be granted,
they have not as yet had any great Effect; but if we consider the Multitude of Complaints that are upon both Sides,
(for the Court of Spain have their Complaints, and have
Demands to make, as well as we) and the great Distance of
the Places where our mutual Complaints are to be examined,
we cannot think it strange, that our Negociations have not,
as yet, been brought to a final Issue. I do not mention this,
Sir, with a Design to make any Excuse for the Behaviour of
the Spaniards to us, or to justify all the Delays they have
been guilty of. I mention it only to shew, that, notwithstanding the Length of the Negociations between us, we
ought not to conclude, that the Court of Spain designs only
to amuse and deceive us; but, on the contrary, that we ought
to presume there may still be some Hopes of our being able
to obtain, in a peaceable Manner, as much as we can expect
by the most successful War: And if this can be done, it will
certainly be a great Saving both of Men and Money to the
Nation. That his Majesty thinks he has still good Reason
to entertain some such Hopes, we may be assured of; otherwise he would have provided, before this Time, for obtaining by Force, what he found he could not obtain by peaceable Means, and would have applied to Parliament in the
most solemn Manner for that Purpose. Therefore, rather
than do any thing that may put an End to all such Hopes, I
think we ought to return Thanks to his Majesty, and extol
the Wisdom and Goodness he has hitherto shewn, by putting
a Force upon his natural Inclinations, and sacrificing that
dazling Glory which is obtained by Victories and Triumphs,
to that solid and true Glory, which is the just Reward of
those Kings, who make the Preservation of the Lives and
Properties of their Subjects, their chief and greatest Concern.'
After Mr. Pelham, several Gentlemen spoke for and
against the Amendment proposed; but I shall give you only
what was said by the two following, viz. Sir John Barnard,
and Sir Charles Wager; the former of whom spoke to the
Effect as follows, viz.
Sir John Barnard.
Sir,
'In all Debates of this Nature, Gentlemen ought to be very
cautious how they run any Parallels betwixt public and private
Transactions. We have heard a good deal with Regard to the
prudential Consideration of our agreeing to the present Motion: But give me leave to observe Sir, that the Character of a
Nation is very different from that of a private Man. A private
Man that has once established a Reputation for Wisdom and
Courage, may easily, and generally does, preserve that Reputation as long as he lives; but whatever Reputation a State or
Kingdom may acquire at any one Time, is so far from continuing as long as that State or Kingdom subsists, that on the
contrary, the Reputation acquired under one King, or one
Administration, always expires as soon as that King or Administration expires; and the Successors must always begin
afresh to acquire and establish a Character for the Nation
under their Administration. A Nation may acquire the
highest Character, the greatest Esteem, under one Reign
or Administration, and yet sink into the lowest Contempt
under the very next. This was the Case of this Nation, in
the Reigns of Edward I. and Edward II. in the Reigns of
Edward III. and Richard II. in the Reigns of Henry V:
and Henry VI. and in the Reigns of our wise Queen Elizabeth and her Successor James I.
'It is in vain therefore, Sir, to pretend, that the Character of this Nation is established, or that we can now depend upon the Character we acquired in any former Reign,
or under any former Administration: For our present Character, we cannot look beyond the Date of the present Administration. Now as his Majesty's Name ought never to
be mentioned in any of our Debates; as nothing that is said
by any Gentleman in this House, can be supposed to relate
to the King, but to the Ministers for the Time being only; I
may therefore beg leave to desire Gentlemen to lay their
Hands upon their Hearts, and declare, what Sort of Character they think this Nation has acquired under our present
Administration, which, I must observe, began before his
Majesty's Accession, and began with a Treaty of Peace between Spain and us, which I never did, nor over shall intirely approve of. If upon this Footing, Gentlemen will examine into the Character we may at present be supposed to
have among our Neighbours, I am afraid it will be found
not to be a very advantageous one, at least with respect to
our Courage, or Readiness to try the Fate of War, in case of
any Injury or Insult's being put upon us.
'I shall grant, Sir, that generally speaking, Peace is
better than War; but it is not always so: A dishonourable
Peace is worse than a destructive War; It is better for a Nation, as well as a private Man, to cease to be, than to subsist in the wretched State of suffering continual Insults and
Indignities; and if, under the present Administration, we
have lest a great Part of the Character we gained in former
Times; if our Neighbours have begun to think, that we
will bear with any Infractions of Treaties, rather than engage in a War, which I hope is not the Case; we may cajole and flatter ourselves with obtaining Redress by peaceful
Negociations or Treaties; but while our Neighbours entertain such a Notion of us, I am fully convinced it will be
impossible. If our Enemies are not yet fully prepared to ruin
us, if they think they may soon have a better Opportunity
than the present for giving us some finishing Blow, they
may for some Time amuse us with Negociations or Congresses, they may even vouchsafe to grant us a Convention
or a Treaty; but these will appear at last to be nothing but
Expedients, artfully contrived by them, and foolishly or
treacherously submitted to by us, for making our Ruin the
more compleat and the more inevitable. During these very
Negociations, and notwithstanding the Treaties they may
vouchsafe to grant us, being convinced they may do it with
Impunity, they will continue to put the same Indignities upon us, till we are reduced so low by our Sufferings, that,
like a Man who has too long neglected a wasting Distemper, we shall not have sufficient Strength left for making use
of that Remedy, which, if it had been applied in Time,
would have produced a certain Cure.
'I shall not pretend, Sir, to be a competent Judge of our
Conduct for several Years past; I shall not pretend to say
positively what we have done, or what we might have done;
but, in my Opinion, we have had several Opportunities for inducing, if not compelling the Spaniards, and likewise some
other of our Neighbours, to give us full Satisfaction for
Injuries past, which would have been the best Security
against any such for the future: Nay, I am of Opinion,
we might have prevented most of the Indignities put upon us,
without involving the Nation in a War. If my Information
be right, our Neighbours the Dutch have fallen upon a Way
of preventing such Indignities, without involving themselves
in a War: I shall not affirm it for a Truth, but we have
been told, that they have lately taken a Method with the
Spanish Guarda Costas, which will make them a little more
cautious, at least with Respect to them, in Time to come:
They have fitted out Ships proper for the Purpose, and
when they have found Guarda Costas not properly commissioned, or such as had seized or plundered any of their Ships,
contrary to the Law of Nations, and to the Instructions they
had from those who gave them their Commissions, they have
treated them as Pirates, and have hung them up at the
Yard's Arm as soon as taken. This is what has been commonly reported; and it calls to my Mind a Story I have
heard of a Gentleman, who received a Box on the Ear
from a famous Bully at a Coffee-House. The Gentleman, it
seems, had not so much Courage as a Gentleman ought to
have, and therefore took it patiently: He thought only of
obtaining Satisfaction in a peaceable Manner; but soon after
he heard, that the same Bully, for such another Piece of Behaviour, had been caned and kick'd out of the Coffee-Room,
by another Gentleman. Gods so! says the Poltroon, if I
had known that Fellow would have been treated in such a
Manner, I should not have taken the Blow he gave me so
patiently.
'All Nations, Sir, are apt to play the Bully with Respect to one another; and if the Government or Administration of a Nation has taken but one Insult tamely, their
Neighbours will from thence judge of the then Character of
that Nation, without any Regard to their Behaviour under a
former Government or Administration; and will accordingly
treat them as Bullies do noted Poltrons; they will kick and
cuff them upon every Occasion: And as a private Man, who
has once got the Character of a Poltroon, can never wipe
off that Character, or avoid such Treatment, but by drubbing
those who have dared to insult him, I am afraid it is now become in vain for us to expect to recover our Character, so
as to obtain Satisfaction for Injuries past, or to avoid meeting
with future Injuries, by any peaceable Means: At least, I
am sure, it is not fit for us at present to shew ourselves so
anxious about avoiding a War, as our agreeing to the Amendment now proposed will clearly shew us to be.
'Having thus, Sir, shewn, that we have no former
Character to depend on, and that nothing will more probably
make a War necessary than our appearing any Way anxious
to avoid it, I shall next examine some of the Arguments made
use of, against our calling for any of the Memorials or Answers from Spain. As to the last Answer from that Court,
which we are told arrived but a few Days ago, tho' certainly it might and ought to have arrived several Weeks ago,
it has been said, that we ought not to call for it, because by
so doing, we shall prevent his Majesty's being able to send
any Reply, till after we have examined into the Affair before
us, and have come to such Resolutions as may be thought
proper upon the Occasion. Sir, for this very Reason we ought,
in my Opinion, to call for it. I think no Reply ought to be
sent but by the Advice of Parliament. The Affair is now
brought, and regularly brought before Parliament; and I hope
no Minister will advise his Majesty to send a Reply, till he
knows the Resolutions of Parliament. If any Minister does, I
am sure it will not be prudent: It will be a Peice of the highest
Disrespect he can shew to a British Parliament; and whatever Posillanimity he may have been guilty of with respect
to foreign Affairs, I am sure there will in that Case be
no Reason to accuse him of Pusillanimity with respect
to domestick. Our obtaining Redress, or our obtaining a
speedy Redress, does not depend upon our speedily sending a
Reply of some Weight. Our Ministers have already sent
many Memorials, many Replies, without any Effect: Our
Business is now to send a Reply that will have some more
Weight than any hitherto sent; and surely a Reply from
his Majesty, founded upon the Resolutions of his Parliament,
will have more Force than any Reply he can send by the
Advice of his Ministers only. Therefore, considering how
little Regard has hitherto been shewn by the Court of Spain,
to the Memorials of our Ministers, I must think it high
Time, even for them, to take the Aid of Parliament, and to
wait for the Resolutions of Parliament, before they
advise his Majesty to send any Reply to the last Answer
from Spain; and for this Reason I should think, that our
Minister, of all others, would be the most fond of having
that Answer laid before Parliament.
'I am surprized, Sir, to hear it said, that the Necessity
of our seeing all the Memorials or Answer from Spain, relating to the Affair before us, does not now appear. It appears, Sir, upon the very Face of every one of the Petitions
we have resolved to take into our Consideration. Does not
every one of them expresly affirm, 'That the Spaniards
have unjustly seized and made Prize of our Merchant Ships,
in the destined Course of their Voyages to and from the
British Colonies?' Do not we know that an unlawful Trade
may be carried on by our Merchant Ships, in the Spanish
West-Indies; and if any of them are detected in the carrying on of such a Trade, they may not only be justly
seized, but justly condemned and made Prize of? And do
not we know that the Spaniards pretend, all or most of the
Ships they have seized, were not in the destined Course of
their Voyage to and from the British Colonies, but were detected and proved to have been carrying on an unlawful
Trade upon their Coasts? Shall we then proceed to determine, that any of our Merchant Ships have been unjustly
seized and made Prize of by the Spaniards, without examining
what the Spaniards have to say in their own Justication?
Don't, for God-sake, Sir, let it be in the Power of our
Enemies to tax us with Injustice; let that be all on the other
Side; but give me leave to say, that such a Conduct would
be unjust, and therefore highly unbecoming a British House
of Parliament; and as we can no way examine into what
the Spaniards have to say in their own Justification, but by
perusing the Memorials they have transmitted to this Court,
therefore, upon the very Face of the Petitions we have resolved to take into our Consideration, it appears necessary
for us to see every one of these Memorials, before we can
come to any Resolution relating to the Petitions now before
us.
'As I have shewn, Sir, that it is absolutely necessary for
us to see all the Memorials or Answers from Spain
before we can proceed to any Determination or Resolution
relating to the Affair we have resolved to enquire into, I
think it very needless to dispute, whether or no there be
any Appearance of its being safe to communicate all or any
of them to this House. If his Majesty should think it
unsafe to communicate any of them, we must put off our
Enquiry, till his Majesty finds that he may safely enable us to
proceed in it, by laying all the proper Materials before us:
But surely, Sir, we ought to proceed upon the Steps that
are previous to that Enquiry, 'till we shall receive the
disagreeable Information from the Crown itself, that it is
not yet safe to lay all the proper Materials before us. For
my Part, I think we have no such Measures to keep with
regard to Spain, as some Gentlemen seem to think necessary.
I put no Confidence in any Negociation we can carry on, no
nor in any Treaty we can conclude. I think our past Behaviour has already made a War unavoidable; and I hope
his Majesty has taken care that this Nation shall be as
powerfully supported by proper Allies, in Defence of our
own Rights and the Rights of Mankind, as Spain can expect to be, in the Incroachments she has made upon us, and
upon the known Rights of all Nations; I mean,
an undisturbed Communication between the different
Parts of their own Dominions, and a free Navigation
in the open Seas.
'For this Reason, Sir, whatever Shame or Danger might
arise to some particular Men, I cannot see the least Danger that could arise to this Nation; nay, I can see many Advantages that might accrue to her, if all the Memorials,
yea all the Transactions, that have passed between Spain and
us, for these twenty Years, were printed and published, as
were not only laid before this House, but before the Publick.
I will even go so far as to say, that it would be neither an
unbecoming nor a rash Step for us, to come to a Resolution
by Way of Advice to his Majesty, that War ought to be
declared against Spain, if, within a short limited Time,
they did not promise Satisfaction and Security in the most
express and the most explicit Terms.
'In private Life, if a Man has been often and for several
Years sollicited, in the most complaisant Manner, to do
Justice, he ought, nay he must be threatened at last, whatever may be the Consequence: If he should then indisercetly stand upon a Punctilio of Honour, a Court of Law
would compel him not only to do Justice, but to pay the
Costs of a Suit, which he had brought upon himself merely
by his own Obstinacy; and I hope the Fleets and Armies of
this Kingdom will always be as effectual against obstinate
Foreigners, as the Officers of Justice can be against obstinate
Subjects.
'I am sorry, Sir, to hear the Multitude of our Complaints
made use of as an Argument for prolonging our Negociations.
Every one knows that the Length of our Negociations has
added greatly to the Number of our Complaints; and now,
it seems, the Multitude of our Complaints ought to prevail
with us to continue our Negociations yet a while longer. At
this Rate our Negociations can never come to an End; for
while they continue, the Number of our Complaints will
certainly increase daily, because our Subjects, as long as
they have any thing to risk, will be making use of those
Rights they think they are intitled to, and this will give
their Enemies a Pretence and an Opportunity to plunder
them. Therefore the Multitude of our Complaints should
rather be a Reason for cutting short our Negociations at any
Rate, than for drawing them out to still a farther Length.
The Ministry, Sir, had better strike a bold Stroke at once,
(and indeed it will be a bold Stroke) by giving up those
Rights that are in Dispute, rather than continue them in
Suspence, as a Snare for making our Subjects a Prey to their
Enemies.
'Then, Sir, as to the Distance of the Places where our
Complaints are to be examined, surely it can be no Excuse
for the Spaniards not having made Satisfaction, with respect
to those Captures at least, which they themselves have above eight Years since acknowledged to have been unjust.
This too may be made a Reason for an eternal Negociation,
as well as for lengthening our Negociations yet a while longer;
for if the Distance of Places be an Excuse for not having made
Satisfaction for an Injury done ten Years ago, and acknowledged as such above eight Years ago, it will be an Excuse
for delaying for ten Years to come, to make Satisfaction for
the Injuries done last Year, and so on in infinitum; and as we
are not, it seems, to have full Satisfaction for any Injury
done, till the whole be adjudged and ascertained at the End
of the Negociation, we must never at this Rate expect full
Satisfaction for any Injury past, present, or future.
'What Complaints, or what Demands the Spaniards may
have against us, as I know nothing of them, I shall not
pretend to say whether they are frivolous or not; I am apt
to suspect they are; but, Sir, if they are not, they may
then be a Pretence, and a just Pretence too, for the Injuries
they have done to us, or at least for their not having made a
full Reparation; therefore those very Complaints or Demands
ought to come under our Consideration at this Juncture; and
as they can appear no where but in those Memorials, which
have been transmitted from the Court of Spain to this Court,
they furnish us with a new and an additional Reason for
shewing, that it is absolutely necessary for us to see all the
Memorials from Spain, before we can properly come to any
Resolution relating to the Affair we have resolved to enquire
into.
'Thus, Sir, in every Light, in which the Question can
be put, it appears, it now appears, necessary, to have all
the Memorials or Answers from Spain, laid before us, if we
are seriously inclined to get at the Bottom of the Affair we
have resolved to enquire into: But I must say, that for my
own Part, I am very easy, whether any one of these Memorials be laid before us; because there is one Fact suggested
in one of the Petitions, which to me appears a sufficient
Cause for an immediate Declaration of War, and will therefore, in my Opinion, make it unnecessary for us to enquire
into any of the other Facts, set forth in the Petitions now before us. In the Petition presented by the Merchants trading
to our Plantations, it is suggested, 'That the Crews of
some of our Merchant Ships are now in Slavery in OldSpain,
where they are most inhumanly treated.' This, Sir, is an Indignity, a barbarous Cruelty, which a simple Release of the
Prisoners cannot excuse. Nothing but Vengeance can atone
for such a cruel, such an unchristian Behaviour. It is a Cruelty,
which the Court of Spain cannot pretend to palliate or excuse,
by imputing it to the Misbehaviour of their Governors in
America. The Government of Spain itself must be loaded
with it; and as it cannot be justified by any Pretence, or by
any Memorial whatsoever, if it be proved, which I believe
it will, I shall think it a sufficient Reason for giving it as
our Opinion, that War ought to be immediately declared against that Kingdom, without enquiring into any of the other
Facts complained of, or seeing any of the Memorials or
Answers they have sent us. It is not enough, Sir, if a Man
has not only injured me in my Property, but basely attacked and maltreated me in my Person; I say, it is not enough, if I shall obtain bare Satisfaction for what I have
suffered in my Property. But Nations, Sir, have no Courts
of Justice to which they care to appeal; they must take the
Remedy that their Power presents them with, which is Satisfaction by Arms.
'Therefore, as I have said, I am extremely easy, whether any of the Spanish Memorials be laid before us or not;
but if, out of an ill-timed Complaisance for the Court of
Spain, and for fear of intruding upon their Punctilio's of
Honour, we now refuse to call for any of these Memorials;
I am afraid this poor Nation can at present neither meet
with Reparation for past Injuries, nor can it expect a proper
Security against being exposed to Injuries of the same Nature, for some Time to come.
Sir Charles Wager spoke in Substance as follows:
Sir Charles Wager.
Sir,
'I must say, that whatever the present Character of this
Nation may be, I think we ought to do nothing rashly, either for preserving or recovering it. A Man of real Courage and good Sense is never jealous of his Character; and
therefore is not so apt to take Things amiss, or so hasty in
resenting Affronts, as one who has only a brutish Temerity,
or a falle and affected Courage. I do not know but that all
the Facts mentioned in the Petitions may be proved; I believe they will; but if they were, I should not take upon
me to say, whether or no they could justify an immediate
Declaration of War against Spain. This is a Judgment
which no Subject ought to make, because the judging and
determining in such a Case, is, by our Constitution, lodged
in the Crown only. But so far I may say, that whatever
may be in these Facts, whatever may be our Case at present, we ought not to show our Teeth till we can bite.
'No Nation in the World, I believe, Sir, ever declared
War, till they were ready to enter upon Action; and as we
at present have neither a Fleet nor an Army ready, sufficient for attacking such a powerful Nation as Spain, I think
we ought not as yet to do any thing, that may look like a
Declaration of War, or even like a Resolution to declare
War. I believe no Gentleman will suppose, that I can be
induced, either by Interest or Inclination, to be against a
War, when I think it is become necessary: On the contrary,
I shall then be as much for it, and as ready to take my
Share in it, as any Man in the Kingdom; but if a War
were now become absolutely necessary, I should not be for
giving any publick Testimony of our being resolved upon a
Rupture, till we are fully prepared, and just ready to enter
upon Action. Every Man knows we are not so at present;
and as our calling for all the Memorials transmitted hither
from Spain, would be a Sort of publick Intimation, that we
are resolved upon a Rupture, I must therefore be for agreeing to the Amendment, and leaving it to his Majesty to
communicate those Memorials to us, when he thinks it safe
and convenient; which he may do, and certainly will do,
without any Address from us for that Purpose.'
Division. Yeas 99 Noes 164.
The Question being put upon the Motion as it stood without the Amendment, it was carried in the Negative, Yeas
99, Noes 164. And the Amendment was then agreed to
without Division.