House of Commons Journal Volume 1
01 March 1621

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1802

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'House of Commons Journal Volume 1: 01 March 1621', Journal of the House of Commons: volume 1: 1547-1629 (1802), pp. 532-533. URL: http://british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=6686 Date accessed: 21 August 2014.


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Jovis, 1o Martii

Privilege-Stay of Trials.

MOTION, about Letters to be written to the Justices of Assise, about stay of Trials, concerning Members of the House. This referred to the Committee for Privileges, to consider of it this Afternoon; and the Precedents to be viewed; and the Course and Manner of writing, and entering them; and the Clerk to attend them, to that end, with the Precedents.

Member Sworn.

Sir Danyell Delyne took the Oaths of Allegiance and Supremacy, in the House, at the Table.

Bankrupts.

Sir Francis Crane presenteth the Bill against Bankrupts.

Davenport.

L. 1. - Davenport.

Reading of Bills.

It is ordered, that the Time, between 9 and 10 of the Clock every Forenoon, shall be set apart for the reading, both of publick, and private Bills.

Drunkenness.

L. 2. - Drunkenness. -

Mr. Cary: - To have the Committee define a Drunkard.

Mr. Guy: - That the Penalties not sufficient to repress Drunkenness.

Mr. Griffyth, - against the Allowance of convincing by One Witness. 2ly, Against the Conviction by View of a Justice of Peace; which may be done upon Malice.

Mr. Serjeant Towse: - Sithence Alehouses the Nurses of all Drunkenness, would have the Justices of Peace answer for the Sureties for Alehouses. - To have an Addition, that none shall be licensed, where the Minister, and some principal Men, shall desire to have none.

Mr. Denney, - against the Justices of Peace securing the Bail.

Sir Edw. Wardor: - To have Drunkenness defined.

Sir Geor. Moore: - To have the Words, " a common Haunter of Tipling-houses," added, instead of the Word " Drunkard." -

Committed to Mr. Crew, all that have spoken, Sir James Perrott, Sir Peter Fretchwel, Sir Francis Barrington, Sir Ro. Askew, Sir Charles Mountague, Mr. Drake, Lord Cavendish, Sir Jo. Walter, Sir Tho. Wyse, Sir Nath. Rich, Sir Tho. Hobby, Sir Jerome Horsey, Mr. Solicitor. Sir Ro. Crane, Sir Jo. Bennett, Sir Francis Goodwynn, Sir Tho. Low, Sir Tho. Wentworth: - Saturday next, at Two of the Clock in the Afternoon, in the Exchequer Chamber.

Sabaoth.

Sir Ed. Mountague reporteth the Bill of the Sabaoth.

- No Nickname shall discourage him. - The Committee careful to avoid all Rubbs: Have considered of the Laws of the Realm, the King's Proclamation, and the King's Declaration. The last Clause read. - This One of the first, and best, Proclamations. - The King's Declaration, to forbid all Concourse of all other Parishes. - All other Sports, not contained in these, left out; neither permitting, nor prohibiting. The Penalty reduced to 3 s. 4 d. Certainty; and the Punishment taken from being upon the Sabaoth-day to another Day.

The Amendments twice read; and ordered to be ingrossed.

Tythes for Fishing.

Ordered, That, where Sir Tho. Row, appointed by the Committee to report the Bill of Fishing, is taken sick, and hath sent the Bill to Mr. Glanvyle, One of the Committee, and present at it, may now report the Bill.

- Three Alterations : Two of Restraint; One of Enlargement. - Restrained it only to the Coasts of America:

2ly, Restrain the taking of Tythes, in respect of Fish and Fishing, not of the Person. For Enlargement, the Word " Adventurer" added.

The Amendments twice read.

Sir W. Heale prayeth a Re-commitment: - For too short, extending only to America.

Mr. Whitson: - No Reason, the Mariner Fisherman should pay Tythe, rather than the other Mariners who make better Voyages.

Sir W. Earle: - That not thought fit this should extend to other Places, besides America.

Sir Tho. Wentworth: - To have it extend to other Parts as well as to America.

Mr. Glanvyle: - If this had been thus, so many Provisoes, as would have clogged the Bill.

Upon Question, re-committed : - Monday next. Exchequer.

Grievances - Proceedings against Monperson.

Mr. Hackwill reporteth from the Committee for G. Monperson. - That in their Examination, they find the Heads and Extent of his Offences to multiply. They desire a present Message to the Lords.

To prepare a Message to the Lords, against Saturday Morning; they being now up, and not sitting again till then.

Message to Lords.

Sir Geor. Fane, and Sir Edw. Sands, to know what the Reason the Gentleman-usher brought this Message from the Lords, that they were risen.

Sir Jo. Jepson: - That the Prince called a Member of this House, and asked him, what Message they intended to send; and that he came, to the Purpose to hear it.

Concealments.

Sir Edw. Coke offereth a Bill for the general Quiet of the Subject against all Pretences of Concealments. - Non intellecti nulla est curatio morbi. - Three Manner of Concealers : l. An open Concealer; where in the Patent expressed, they must be such. - Dishonourable in initio, to grant away any Land, before the Title tried.

2ly, Commissions. - 200l. Land gotten: They go by Commission : Find an Office secretly, then get a Patent. - No such Proviso in that Patent.

3ly, A worse than all, against Religion, * and Education in Learning. For take away Reward of Learning, it consequently falleth. - Occidit presbyterium - Presbyteros - These get a Commission of all Lands not in Charge - A Concealer ever a Beggar before he died. - For Charity, surveyeth all the Hospitals of England: - Grammar-schools. - All these fall under Concealments. - Overthrow the King's Tenures, and pass away his Advowsons. - Five Men, in his Observation, never prospered : Alchimists, Monopolists, Promoters, Concealer, Depopulator: - 6th, (new) Projector - This Bill hath Five Parts: A Bill of Grace : 1. Provideth, negatively, the King shall not sue, except his Majesty in Possession, or have received the Profits within 60 Years; which will break the Back of all the Three Concealers. The 2d, that all shall enjoy, against the King, fill the Lands enjoyed by them 6o Years, whereof the

King no Profit, ut supra. 3ly, Against all Patentees of Concealments. 4ly, Provideth for the King's Tenure, Rent, Herryots, to be as before the Making of this Act. 5ly, A general Saving for all; except the King, and his Heirs, and Successors; and all the Patentees, and their Heirs.

L. 1. An Act for the general Quiet of the Subject against all Pretences of Concealments whatsoever.

Grievances- Proceedings against Monperson.

Sir Ro. Phillippes moveth, sithence Sir G. Monperson's, Offences so heinous, to lose no Time, but to resolve to go to the Lords on Saturday, concerning the Business of Sir G. Monperson: And, upon Question, Resolved.

All the Privy Council, all the former Committee, and as many else as will. Sir Edw. Coke to deliver the [Message,] upon Question.

Sir Edw. Sands : - The Matter of great Weight: To hew at the Roots of the Tree of the Kingdom. -

To propose to the Lords, that, searching into the Grievances, they had found One, of so a Nature and of so high a Strain, both against King and Kingdom, as never the like. - Is for Sir Edw. Coke to be the Messenger.

Sir Edw. Coke excuseth his own Abilities : - Was not at the last Committee, therefore not fit. - Is for Mr. Tho. Crew.

Mr. Solicitor is for Sir Edw. Coke to be the Messenger.

Supersedeas, &c.

L. 3. An Act to prevent and punish the Abuses in procuring Process, and Supersedeas, for the Peace and good Behaviour, out of his Majesty's Courts at Westmynster; and to prevent the Abuses in procuring Writs of Certiorari out of the said Courts, for the Removing of Indictments found before Justices of the Peace in their general Sessions.

Mr. Alford, - against the Bill. - Too much Work already for Justices of Peace. Justices will not meddle out of their Divisions : - Much Partiality, sometime Malice. No Help for this, but appealing to the higher Courts. - Will make Justices of Peace more absolute than the Judges in higher Courts.

Sir Francis Goodwyn, contra,

Sir Edw. Coke: - This Bill concerneth Two of the King's Courts at Westminster; Chancery, and King's Bench : Both coram Rege. No Touch, in this Bill, of any Jurisdiction of those Courts, but taketh away the Abuse of the Party. - Qui tollit abusum, confirmat usum; confirmat proprietatem, qui tollit iniquitatem. - King's Bench, Common Bench, and Exchequer, have been limited. Nisi prius granted by Edw. I. propter intolerabilem jacturam Juratorum. - Best trusted where least known. - Spendeth his Money abroad, where may have Justice at home. - That, when he Chief Justice in the King's Bench, never granted any such Writ, but in Court; nor made any Order, but in Court; for a Judge of a Court, and not of a Chamber.

Mr. Brooke: - To make this Bill a Probationer, till the next Parliament.

Mr. Glanvyle : - against this Bill. - Mischief on both Parts. - Offereth a great Affront to the King's Process. - Will not constare, whether the Writ granted in open Court, or not. Process, by this means, may come to be contemned, and disobeyed. -

2ly, The Writ to be granted only upon the Party's own Oath; where, peradventure, cannot be absent.

Mr. Crew, contra; - and answereth all the Objections made against the Bill.

Upon Question, passed.